The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Jack Penner): Would the Committee of Supply please come to order. This section of the Committee of Supply will be dealing with the Estimates for the Status of Women. Would the minister's staff please enter the Chamber.
We are on 22.1.(a) Manitoba Women's Advisory Council (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits $161,200.
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister responsible for the Status of Women): Just before we continue with the questioning, I just had a couple of pieces of information I would like to provide to the member and would like to table.
First of all, there were some answers to questions which were raised during concurrence last year. I have those answers--
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): I am wondering whether the honourable members in the loge would be able to conduct their city council meeting outside of the Chamber.
An Honourable Member: Absolutely. Outside. I apologize, Mr. Chairman. We forgot where we were.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): And those three gentlemen to my right, if they would conduct their meeting outside the Chamber, I would appreciate that. Maybe then we could hear the proceedings. Thank you very kindly. You may proceed, Madam Minister.
Mrs. Vodrey: As I was saying to the member, there were a series of questions which were posed during concurrence last year. I have the answers to those questions. I have them, and I am prepared to table them rather than read the details into the records in the interest of time, if the member would find that helpful.
Yesterday, during the opening remarks of Estimates, the member asked for some of the statistics that I have used in speaking regarding the effects of physical fitness and recreation on young women. I have for her today just some of the quotes and statements that I have made regarding the program Take The Challenge, and I will table that for her interest today as well.
With that, I am prepared to proceed with questioning under the agreement that we had yesterday in an attempt to deal with the questions in a comprehensive way.
Ms. Diane McGifford (Osborne): Thank you, Mr. Chair, for the silence in the Chamber, too, and thank you to the minister for that material. I will look forward to reading it.
Actually, I have some questions that are perhaps more relevant to the advisory council and some questions that are more relevant to the Women's Directorate, then some general questions. I am willing to ask them in any order. I wonder if the minister would like to tell me the order in which she would like those questions asked.
Mrs. Vodrey: We have with us at the table today the staff members from the Women's Directorate whom I introduced yesterday. We also have at the table today the chairperson of the advisory council for the Status of Women, whom I would like to introduce, Sandy Hasenack, and also the executive director of the advisory council, Sue Barnsley, at the table as well. So I am prepared to take the questions in the order the member has them.
Ms. McGifford: To begin with, I noticed that the Status of Women's budget is down this year by $13,000. If I go back several years, I notice that if we took--and I am taking this year quite arbitrarily--1992-93 and compare 1997-98, the budget for the Status of Women is down by $30,000. Of course, that is not taking into consideration the impacts and effects of inflation. I wonder if the minister would like to comment on this kind of decrease and the ways in which it is impacting the work of the Status of Women.
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Mrs. Vodrey: All parts of government have had some very difficult decisions to make over the past few years in an effort to preserve a proportion of the budget to the major areas of health, education and services to families. So the Status of Women has also done its part in terms of looking at its budget to determine where, in fact, some changes could be made, but changes which would not be a detriment in any way to the work that is done.
The changes that have taken place, I can tell the member that staff have not been removed from any programs, that we have in fact made a much stronger use of technological support, so there has been some reduction in the administrative support area and that would account for some of the changes over the past years.
Ms. McGifford: If I look at a five-year history of staffing, from '93-94 to '97-98, now the number of staff have reduced. I am assuming, then, the minister is saying that it has not had an impact because the staff reductions have been such that technological developments have been able to atone for those reductions.
Mrs. Vodrey: I understand also, another of the changes, the numbers that the member refers to as staff years also included some staff years for seniors. There was then a change where the staff then moved and worked specifically only with the Seniors Directorate, so it was reflected as a change within our numbers, but in fact I am informed that we have not reduced staff in the area of programming, but that there has been some reduction in administrative staff due to the technological supports available.
Ms. McGifford: I know yesterday when the minister spoke, she mentioned Shaking the Tree in her introductory remarks which, of course, was the meeting, conference or workshops--I am not quite sure exactly how we should describe it--which took place on International Women's Day. My understanding was that there was a cost to attend that event and that the cost, I believe it was $35, if my memory serves me correctly.
I think the minister knows that I consider a cost, because of things that we have said in the House, for an International Women's Day event to be wrong because the effect is exclusionary and a reduction of accessibility, not to mention, of course, that this particular conference took place on a working day during working hours. So I would like to ask the minister whether the cost for the event was to cover expenses, was there any money made on this event?
(Mr. Ben Sveinson, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)
Mrs. Vodrey: This cost, in terms of registration cost, simply covered the cost of expenses. There was not a profit made. I note too that when, I believe it was, the Beijing network held a conference on some other issues about a week or so following, there was also a cost to that too. So that a minor cost is not unusual. Our government felt, first of all, the registration costs were quite reasonable at $35. They allowed for greater accessibility. They included a light breakfast and lunch, as well as sessions which had both local and national experts on a number of topics and issues. Since we have both the advisory council and the directorate here, I would like to say that the Women's Advisory Council sponsored 27 women to attend that conference, and certainly played an active role to try and meet any requests, or at least some of the requests that came forward for people who may have needed some additional support.
Ms. McGifford: Mr. Chair, I do not think it is quite fair to compare the Beijing event to a government-sponsored event. I do not think the Beijing people have the same kind of resources, and I know as well that at the Beijing conference, and perhaps this was also true at Shaking the Tree, the minister could provide me with the information if it were the case. I know at the Beijing event there is a commitment not to keep anybody away because that person cannot afford to attend.
So what I really wanted to ask the minister is if she would undertake next March, when International Women's Day comes again, to have the major event sponsored by the government, free of charge?
Mrs. Vodrey: Well, I would like to start out by clearing up any impression that any women were turned away by their inability to meet the registration fee. The advisory council was prepared and able to sponsor 35 women. There were 27 applicants, and so everyone who applied was assisted. There was the ability to assist some women, and there was not an uptake on it.
Secondly, I would like to remind the member that the government celebrations for International Women's Day are, in fact, free of charge. That is an invitation which goes out widely, and those women are invited to attend. There is not a cost at the government celebration. However, government also decided to hold a conference in addition, but on that same day and at a reasonable cost.
We are hopeful that we will be able to hold another conference in approximately two years time. We hold it every two years, and we will look at what the situation is at that time, but at the moment, I can say, Mr. Chair, it does not appear to be unfair or exclusive, because there were efforts made to include the women who wanted to attend.
Ms. McGifford: Well, the minister points out that it was not the government's celebration, so it is just fortuitous, accidental, that it happened to be on International Women's Day? It actually has nothing to do with International Women's Day?
Mrs. Vodrey: No, that is not what I said. What I said was, the government's celebration of International Women's Day, as it was celebrated, I believe, when the member's party was in government, which was a reception, and has been continued by this government as well. That does occur, and that is free of charge. That government celebration of International Women's Day occurs and is free of charge.
But in addition to that and holding it on International Women's Day, we have held a conference focused on issues of importance to women, but that is not the only part of the International Women's Day recognition. There is also the celebration, the free-of-charge reception which has occurred before and continues to occur.
Ms. McGifford: I wonder, I seem to have missed it, was the registration fee for the conference $35?
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, it was $35.
Ms. McGifford: Well, since the conference apparently intended to attract 35 women, which seems to me a very small number, by the way, if those women were not asked to pay at $35 a shot, really the government would be paying just a little over a thousand dollars, which does not seem to be much to put out for the women of Manitoba.
So I just really do want to reiterate my request that next time there is a conference of this kind that it be underwritten by the government and women not be asked to pay a registration fee.
Mrs. Vodrey: I did not say that the government's intention was to attract 35 women who found the registration difficult to pay. What I said was, there were 35 sponsorships available through the advisory council. There was not an uptake on all 35.
Ms. McGifford: I certainly did misunderstand that piece of information.
I understand from past Estimates and from what the minister said in her introductory remarks that the Women's Advisory Council sometimes and, in fact, this year has met with the public and received public submissions or presentations. I wonder if the minister could tell me what concerns these women have presented to the council in these presentations and what the council has done with these concerns.
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Mrs. Vodrey: The advisory council has, in fact, met with the public. They hold a number of opportunities for the public to meet with them, some meetings in which the council has travelled. There have been invitations to people within that community to come and present and express their interests and concerns and also the meetings which occur on sort of a semiregular basis, I believe bimonthly, in which they hold meetings of interest, topics of interest to women, and women have the opportunity to express some of their concerns. In terms of the details of what occurred in those public meetings, I will just get a little bit more detailed information from the council.
Just to continue, the advisory council informs me some of the issues which were raised were child care issues which are, of course, issues of interest to women all across Canada. Then, I understand, in another meeting in Souris there were approximately 15 groups who came and expressed a whole range of issues of interest to women and the community; the sustainability of the environment, issues relating to depression, child care arose again, an interest in the Elizabeth Fry Society, an interest in areas of women's health.
In one issue, a concern around a Pharmacare issue was raised. There was a meeting held in my office with the Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik) following that and a teleconference with the northern woman who raised the issue.
Ms. McGifford: Is there an attempt on the part of the advisory council to meet with women around the province? That is to say, the minister has indicated that the advisory council has been to Souris. Does the advisory council try to get to the North and to all parts of the province?
Mrs. Vodrey: In my opening remarks I did try to give a list of meeting places that the advisory council has met outside of the city of Winnipeg. Some of them, as referenced, were in Souris, Morden, Winkler. There has also been a meeting in Thompson. There was to have been a meeting in Swan River last week, but because of the flood that has been postponed to June 9. There is also a meeting scheduled in Dauphin in September and that will be followed by a meeting in Eastman. With the meeting in Eastman that will have completed the advisory council's goal of meeting in each region of Manitoba and making sure that they have had an opportunity to speak to women and others who have an interest in issues which are important to women.
I know at another time there was a meeting with RCMP representatives. So they are very open to the issues which are of concern to women as well as meeting with women's groups.
Ms. McGifford: So then, if I am understanding the minister correctly, the advisory council attempts, on a yearly basis, to visit each of the four sections or divisions or areas of Manitoba.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, the advisory council has a legislative requirement of at least six meetings. They hold three of those meetings in the city of Winnipeg. They hold three others as outreach meetings. So each individual year, they are not able to reach each region, but they do over a two-year period at least have one meeting in each of the regions of the province.
Ms. McGifford: To return to the question of issues, the minister has cited a number of issues which women brought to the advisory council. The minister mentioned a follow-up meeting on Pharmacare with the Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik). One of the questions I had been asking earlier was: What specifically does the advisory council do with the issues that women present to them? What actions, or indeed are there actions stemming from presentations? I wonder if the minister could give me some information.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, some of the actions do require meetings with ministers. Certainly I had the opportunity to meet with the chair of the advisory council, also to attend a meeting of the advisory council, and that certainly is open to me as minister, to have the issues of interest and concern raised to me so that I am aware of those issues.
I have also facilitated a meeting with the Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik). We dealt with issues relating to women's interests in some health issues, and the one example I gave was raised by a pharmacist in northern Manitoba on a certain issue. So we attempted to deal with that.
At other times, the issues are also raised as part of participation in committees which members of the advisory council sit on, and they are used as another way to input as there is a development of thinking in certain areas. I understand they also participate in the Beijing network as well.
Some of the issues that have been raised were the number of women represented on the regional health authority boards, and I believe that there has been a full answer to that given now to the Beijing network, the Beijing group, which has recently been sent to them. They have looked at some of the women's special health needs and how they will be met under regionalization. They also were very interested in some issues that relate to women locally but are federal issues, the issue of their interest in the CPP credit splitting, and they made representation to the federal committee. They also were very interested in the issues of the civil justice task force, because the issues of the civil justice side of Justice tend to relate very much to the family law side, so they made a presentation in an attempt to influence what may be done further.
So the advisory council acts. They have an access directly to the minister, and where they request, I will arrange a meeting with another minister involved. They also have the opportunity to speak to committees and to act on the information that they have and believe it is important to put that women's voice.
The advisory council, I am very, very interested in their work, because they are representative of women across the province in quite a range of professional or working backgrounds. So it is an opportunity to gain information from a wide range of women in their own communities.
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Ms. McGifford: Mr. Chair, when the minister was talking about the issues, she mentioned the issues women presented to the advisory council. She cited child care issues as a concern, and I am also concerned about child care issues. So I wonder if the minister could tell me what those issues were and what the advisory council has done to help alleviate or discuss those issues or further those issues with this government.
Mrs. Vodrey: In the area of child care, the advisory council had our colleague the MLA for St. Norbert (Mr. Laurendeau), who conducted the review of child care, come to present to them. On the advisory council there are two members who are educators. One is specifically an early childhood educator at St. Boniface College, and another is principal of an elementary school. Those two people from the advisory council have been invited to sit on the Minister of Family Services' review of the child care recommendations, so they have an actual voice into the development that is ongoing at the moment.
Ms. McGifford: Then, if I am understanding the minister correctly, it was not women from a community who met with the advisory council to raise child care issues. It was the member for St. Norbert who made a presentation and therefore caused child care issues to be raised.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, no, that is not the only input. I did reference that women have spoken to the advisory council on this issue. Some of the issues that those women have raised are issues such as a need for flexibility, the issue of flexibility in child care for part-time workers or seasonal workers, so those are some of the issues directly from the community. In addition to that, council met with the Manitoba Child Care Association. The Manitoba Child Care Association presented to them some issues of child care in rural Manitoba as well as in some of the larger centres such as Winnipeg.
Ms. McGifford: I am wondering if any of the women who made presentations to the advisory council cited accessibility as a problem or were concerned about the fact that the number of child care spaces in the province has been frozen.
Mrs. Vodrey: I hesitate to step into the area and defend where my colleague the Minister of Family Services (Mrs. Mitchelson) will have a direct explanation in terms of child care spaces, but I understand our record in the area of child care is, in fact, very good across this country. However, for women, the issue of flexibility is a particularly important issue: how to access the kind of child care that a parent might need if they were, in fact, part-time workers or seasonal workers, students, or whatever.
Just to make sure that there is no question about our child care program, I believe and I am very pleased to state that our government has always recognized the crucial need for a child care program. We have recognized that it does need to be affordable and it does need to be accessible.
My colleague the Minister of Family Services has undertaken a review, a very co-operative review, I am very pleased to say, in order to address some of the issues which have been raised by women in order to make it an even better child care system.
Mr. Chair, I would like to say, I am informed the 1997-98 child care budget has remained the same as that of the 1996-1997 budget, that the children with disabilities program has received additional funding for '97-98, that a thorough review of Manitoba's child daycare regulations, their policies and their systems has begun. The purpose of the review is an important one. It is to simplify and to deregulate and to streamline the administrative processes and provide more flexible child care support for working parents as well as parents in training. That is an issue which the advisory council has raised, as have others; parents who are in training programs.
As I mentioned, the consultation team was chaired by the member for St. Norbert (Mr. Laurendeau), and it has included service users, representatives from various types and models of child care, representatives from member child care associations and government representatives. Now the two members of the advisory council with some background in this work as well as having had the opportunity to hear from women across the province are now participating in the next step which has been set up by the Minister of Family Services (Mrs. Mitchelson). So I would not want to leave any doubt on the record about our government's commitment. Part of that commitment is to make sure that we have ongoing ways to speak to the people of Manitoba.
Ms. McGifford: As the minister knows, there are always at least two opinions on everything, and ours is quite different on this particular issue. But I would like to point out to the minister, the government's record on child care is, at the moment, completely and totally irrelevant. I merely asked if any women who appeared before the advisory council happened to bring up issues or happened to have two concerns: one, accessibility; and secondly, did any women express concern at the number of spaces being frozen? This was not an attack on the government's child care record; I will reserve that for Family Services. I am merely trying to get information about the presentations to the advisory council.
Mrs. Vodrey: I feel it is important to put forward our government's record as a reference point for discussion about what may be heard, and also if there is ever any doubt about our government's commitment, to again put it forward. In addition to the issues which I have spoken to the member about, the one other one that the advisory council tells me they heard was a transportation issue that came from northern Manitoba. It was Thompson, and the issue there was that as there is not rural bus service. There is a question of how to get children to the daycare program. So those are the issues that I have had presented to me as presented to the advisory council.
Ms. McGifford: In other words, there were no concerns about accessibility; there were no concerns about the number of cases being frozen?
Mrs. Vodrey: I am informed by the advisory council that issues which may be close to the ones the member is speaking about, perhaps not exactly on point to what she is raising, is that the flexibility issue was the issue of great concern, so that there would be some flexibility in terms of time, in terms of, I am presuming, how some of the spaces are used and whether or not there could be some sharing of a space if that was what was required between families.
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Ms. McGifford: Another issue that the minister cited was that some of the women who presented to the advisory council were concerned about the number of women on rural health authority boards, and the minister suggested that that had been satisfactorily resolved. I am interested in the way in which it was resolved, and I am also interested since the minister must know about the number of women on rural health authority boards, because I have not been able to get that information.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, what I said to the member was that, where these issues had been raised in actually a meeting which I attended with the Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik) and also with the former chair of the advisory council and also members of the directorate, the issue of women's representation on the regional health authorities was raised. I have recently responded to that letter, and I am happy to give the member the response because I think it is enlightening. This response has, in fact, I understand--or it is certainly available to be spoken about for anyone who has questions.
I understand that to date approximately 30 percent of the make-up of the new RHAs are women, and I think it is important to state that the requirements respecting composition and selection have made the selection of members difficult and challenging, partly because I understand that, first of all, there were more than 500 nominations received from Manitobans interested in serving on the board, and applications for men in some areas certainly outnumbered those of women. But an additional factor in affecting the selection process is that many of the people who are nominated for positions on the RHAs are not eligible to serve because they are currently employed in a health care service or are practising as a health care provider in the region.
The contribution of women to the health services as providers of health care and users of health care has always been, and certainly will continue to be, important to this government. So, if a large number of the women who may have been nominated were in fact involved in health care, it was important to make the point that there are other opportunities for women to get involved in Manitoba's health care reform. Women will have the opportunity to get involved in the health care reform in their region as members of the district health councils and also the provider advisory councils, so that the DHCs, or the district health councils, and the PACs, or provider advisory councils, will then work closely with the RHAs in each region.
Ms. McGifford: If indeed 30 percent of the membership of rural health authority boards is female and 70 percent is male, it would seem to me to be a splendid opportunity for the minister to do some outreach and help to change those figures when appointments are again made. As I understand, appointments will be made, and there will not be elections to these boards. I wonder if this minister is interested and is aiming as part of her work as the Minister for Status of Women to help achieve gender parity on these boards.
(Mrs. Shirley Render, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)
Mrs. Vodrey: Well, certainly where we have qualified applicants and they are able to then be considered on merit. I know that the Minister of Health has had this issue presented to him, certainly by me as a Minister for the Status of Women. I know that he is aware of this, and now it is to encourage qualified individuals to be nominated and for those individuals who might be interested but are not able to be qualified because of their work within the health care system to make sure that there is an opportunity for those people to serve on the advisory boards.
Ms. McGifford: Well, I think that the minister and I would agree that not every qualified woman in the province of Manitoba is a health care professional, and in fact there are probably enough qualified women in the province of Manitoba in order to achieve parity on these boards. I cannot believe that there are not. Actually, I find it vaguely insulting to hear this word "qualified" bandied about so frequently.
Mrs. Vodrey: Well, I do not think there is anything wrong with requesting a qualification. That is true in the selection of the judiciary. That is true in the selection of anyone for a position that in fact must be a qualified individual in order to be considered.
However, one of the things that we found and I certainly found as Minister of Justice in looking at women's representation in the judiciary was to encourage women to put forward their applications and apply. So one of the things that we are going to be doing through the Women's Directorate is preparing information on the rural health authorities, distributing that information to women's groups across the province so that women then will understand how the rural health authorities work, what the qualifications are, see themselves as people able to be nominated for that and then decide that they would like to go forward.
My sense is, though I would have to check with the Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik), that there was a lot of interest from women in the first round but that many of those were people who already worked in the health care profession. So the information that we have to get out to women across the province is, here are the kinds of backgrounds or experiences which would qualify you; here is the information. Now begin to consider yourself as someone who might like to be nominated.
So I agree with the member that it does take something active to encourage women to then say, yes, I am willing to apply. Am I qualified to apply? That is where the word "qualification" comes in, and that is what the information that is going to be distributed by the Women's Directorate will in fact accomplish.
Ms. McGifford: I wanted to suggest to the minister that there is nothing wrong with having qualifications and demanding qualifications. The error is in and the insult is in suggesting that there are not qualified women. I am very pleased to hear about the outreach initiative. It seems to me to be a splendid idea and very much in keeping with the community development outreach idea that I had suggested.
I wonder if the minister--I want to ask a couple of quick questions about the composition of the council. I know from what the minister has told me before that there is an attempt to have the members of the advisory council, the membership of the advisory council representative of the province geographically, ethnically, economically and socially, I am sure. What I am unclear about and wanted to ask the minister was: How is the chair of the advisory council chosen?
Mrs. Vodrey: The chair of the advisory council is the appointment by the minister through Order-in-Council. The person appointed to that position is one where we look for community involvement, where we look for ability to manage a meeting and also to set an agenda, goals and objectives, and to follow through.
Ms. McGifford: What is the duration of the appointment of the chair of the advisory council?
Mrs. Vodrey: The appointment is for three years.
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Ms. McGifford: During her opening remarks, the minister mentioned the, I believe, bimonthly meetings which the advisory council conducted on women's issues. I wonder if she could give me a little bit of information and perhaps address issues such as the topics covered, the format of the meeting, who gets an invitation, how many women have been attending.
Mrs. Vodrey: In the handout that I provided to the member just as we began, you will notice, I think it is on page 2 of that handout, that there is listed for the member some of the topics which have been covered at the bi-monthly meetings, topics such as Nellie McClung, CPP issues in terms of pension splitting, and other topical issues for women, women in technology and so on. The meetings are generally developed in a way that it will serve a need which may have been raised or which has been identified. The meetings are informal. There are usually speakers, there are usually handouts, and in terms of attending, there are information and invitations sent to all of the women's organizations that we communicate with on a regular basis and also some government offices where they may have a particular interest in an issue that is being dealt with on that particular day.
Ms. McGifford: I am wondering if the advisory council plans to continue these meetings and, if so, what some of the topics might be for the forthcoming year.
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, the council intends to continue the meetings. Three of the topics that I am informed they will be pursuing, one on the 28th of this month is women and technology. Another one being planned is women's nutritional needs and lifestyle, and a third one in the planning is women's financial needs, RRSPs and other financial planning instruments.
Ms. McGifford: I noticed in the most recent edition of About Women that there had been new appointments to the Women's Advisory Council, including a woman named Patricia Flaws, who is described as having a background in business and running her own skills training business, particularly in the area of helping women on social assistance move into the workforce. I have every reason to believe that Patricia Flaws is very qualified to be a member of the council and yet it occurred to me that if she is helping women on social assistance moving into the workforce, then there may be a possibility that she is a nongovernment person who is doing some work for government, that is, helping individuals make the transition from social assistance to the workforce.
With this in mind, on April 2, I wrote to the Minister of Family Services (Mrs. Mitchelson) asking for a list of such persons, that is, nongovernment persons who were doing this work. It seemed to me that if--and I really want to stress if--Ms. Flaws is working as a nongovernment person for government, then she should not be really advising the government on matters of concern to women because there may possibly be a conflict of interest. The Minister of Family Services has not responded to me, so I do not know whether Ms. Flaws does any work for government. I do want to ask this minister if she will answer the question, that is to say: Does Ms. Flaws do any work for government or government programs related to social assistance?
Mrs. Vodrey: Madam Chair, I understand that Pat Flaws did at one time work as a consultant with Taking Charge!, but I am informed that, to the best of our knowledge, that employment ended six months ago. That particular contract has ended now. If there is anything further then I will certainly look into it. I am not aware of anything at the moment, but it is certainly a point to be examined.
Ms. McGifford: Madam Chair, I thank the minister for her very direct answer to the question. During her opening remarks I believe the minister said, and I may be a little off base here because I have not seen the Hansard from yesterday, but I believe the minister said that at times the advisory council assisted women with individual cases of violence. I wonder if the minister could give me a little bit more information on the ways in which the council might provide this assistance. The reason I am asking--well, maybe the minister could answer.
Mrs. Vodrey: Madam Chair, the way that the council has done this is--I am told that there are literally hundreds of calls which come to the advisory council of women who have some concerns or who are at some level of distress. The advisory council then acts as a referral but, in referring, they do take the time to listen to the issues which are presented by those women and then if there is perhaps some assistance even required, in terms of accessing the appropriate assistance or help, they will also do that.
I think it is well known to people, it certainly happened to me many times as a councillor, that it is sometimes too difficult for someone to pick up the phone and phone the justice system or the formal Family Services. So people do choose to help them, someone where they feel comfortable, and so that has been the role of the advisory council, and they have been able to assist in making the referrals.
Ms. McGifford: So the role is to provide referral and assistance. My concern was, and I did not really think that women at the advisory council were providing counselling, but it did strike me that if that was happening it could be a concern because it would be important for women to relate to people who were fully qualified and trained counsellors and working in the profession, so the minister has alleviated my concern.
I understand that one of the chief activities of the Women's Directorate is to analyze legislation, policies, programs and make recommendations to government and so ensuring, of course, that women's concerns are considered. It really seems to me an absolutely huge job, especially when I consider the numbers of staff. So I wonder how priorities are set. How does the directorate determine what to analyze? For example, does the directorate automatically review all bills, all proposed legislation, with a view to determining the possible effects on women?
Mrs. Vodrey: The directorate develops an annual plan with priorities, the priorities of which I read into the record in my speech yesterday, priorities such as women's economic security, women's education and training, violence against women, women's health--attention to young women in particular--and then with that annual plan they then monitor interdepartmental committees or developments of government in those particular areas. That is how the priorities are set.
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Ms. McGifford: The Minister of Consumer and Corporate Affairs (Mr. Radcliffe) said in his Estimates that the Residential Tenancies branch was computerizing its records. I am wondering if the Minister for the Status of Women was asked to give advice through the Women's Directorate on women's safety in this matter.
Mrs. Vodrey: The answer is yes.
Ms. McGifford: Could the minister tell me what advice the Women's Directorate gave to the Minister of Consumer and Corporate Affairs?
Mrs. Vodrey: I understand that the letter was received not that long ago and that the information will be forthcoming to me very shortly, I am hopeful, I understand as soon as this week some of the details to be considered and then consider it with my colleague. So it is common and I believe helpful when other departments do contact the directorate and work with them.
There are a number of issues which again are very difficult to speak about because they are still issues of government which will be brought forward within the next while, but I can tell you that there is consultation, and the directorate certainly does, in my mind, a very, very important job, and I know they work very hard in those areas.
Ms. McGifford: I wonder if the minister could tell me what indirect salary costs are under the Women's Directorate? I note that the Women's Directorate has approximately $4,000 in that line, and I am not sure what they are.
Mrs. Vodrey: That reflects the two STEP students who have worked with the directorate. We have two STEP students. One is researching women's contribution in politics, and that is for Women's History Month, which ends in October. The other is a STEP student for the summer to address important aspects of girls' socialization. During the months of May and June the student will be visiting middle schools to make presentations to girls with a view of encouraging them to continue their studies in science and math. In addition she will be encouraging them to consider careers not traditionally taken up by young women. She will be outlining careers that will follow study in some of the courses eligible in our Training for Tomorrow Scholarship Awards Program.
The student hired in this area is a creative communications student at Red River Community College. I would just like to mention that creative communications is one of the eligible courses for the Training for Tomorrow Scholarship, so I think that looks like a fairly good match.
Ms. McGifford: I am glad that the minister brought up the scholarships, because I wanted to ask her something about scholarships too. I notice under the Women's Directorate there is $50,000 set aside for scholarships. I believe the minister said those scholarships were for $1,000 each? I understand that the recipients of the scholarship are generally, and maybe I am wrong, but my understanding is they are generally involved in a two-year program. So would that be $1,000 for each of two years?
Mrs. Vodrey: The total is $1,000. The scholarship is $500 each year.
Ms. McGifford: I am assuming the second $500 is given when a student completes the first year in a manner that suggests merit.
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, that is correct.
Ms. McGifford: The scholarships are reserved for students who are attending a community college?
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes. These scholarships are focused on students attending community colleges.
Ms. McGifford: The community colleges would be--are there three or four in Manitoba? I know there is Keewatin, Brandon and Red River. I am missing one.
Mrs. Vodrey: Keewatin Community College, Assiniboine Community College and Red River Community College.
Ms. McGifford: Generally speaking, do the recipients of these scholarships, do some of the recipients attend each of these or do they mostly go to one or does it depend on program? I am just wondering about the breakdown.
Mrs. Vodrey: I think I remember the question, the details of the question. It involves students who are attending at each of the three community colleges. It tends to follow population patterns in that the largest number of students or programs for which students may apply are at Red River Community College. I understand that is approximately 70 percent. The remaining 30 percent is then divided between the two other community colleges.
(Mr. Ben Sveinson, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)
Ms. McGifford: Has there been any attempt to follow the careers of the people, the young women who have received these scholarships to see if they have obtained employment?
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, they are being tracked through the community colleges, and the STEP student this summer, who is working to encourage young women in socialization to go into some of the nontraditional programs, is also following up with those students.
Ms. McGifford: I thank the minister for the information on the scholarships. It seems to me to be an extremely important endeavour to encourage women to become proficient in sciences, both through the community colleges and through universities, so we certainly support that government endeavour.
I notice, Mr. Chair, that the managerial salary in the Women's Directorate has increased by $9,000 this year, which is over 10 percent. Perhaps I am missing something, but this seems to me quite wrong at a time when the overall budget for the Status of Women is decreasing, when civil servants are basically holding the line and when employees in most areas of the public sector, for example teachers, really are not getting any increases in salary. I wonder how this government justifies that kind of a salary increase.
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Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, just to clarify, the number does make it appear as if it is a significant increase credited to that position. The actual staff year salary increase is 1,l00, which is on the merit increase, and the remaining salary dollars reflect a change in the presentation of basic salary costs in that it includes the one-day accrual and also all the merit increments for all staff. It was simply a method of presentation.
Ms. McGifford: I thank the minister for that clarification. One thing that I noticed in examining the numbers in the Women's Directorate is that the number of staff years does not really add up to eight. It adds up to 7.52, which seems to me closer to the 7.5 than it does to eight, and I am not quite sure why it was rounded off to eight.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, I just had to have a look at what the member was referring to. I am sorry for taking a moment but it, in fact, does add up to eight. There is one managerial, 5.26 professional technical. That .26 refers to 26 weeks out of 52 so it is a half staff year. Then the next is 1.26, which is another one and 26 weeks, so if you add up the two 26 weeks you get to one whole staff year. Then you add up the 5, 6, 7 plus the two 26 weeks, it gets to eight.
Ms. McGifford: So when we see 5.26 that really means five and a half .
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, that is just the method of presentation.
Ms. McGifford: The remainder of the questions I have do not particularly concern, I do not believe, either the Women's Directorate or the Manitoba Women's Advisory Council, but are more general in nature and more to do with women's issues in general. I have a page from the Civil Service Commission's booklet, Putting Equity to Work, a handbook for managers, and it presents the following information. Perhaps I could cite, it is page 27. It says, female employees are concentrated in administrative support occupations, that is 94 percent, underrepresented in management, administration, corrections, regulatory inspections, material management, resource science, architecture, engineering trades, physical sciences, and thirdly, comprise 69 percent of all term employees.
I am sure that the minister, who I believe is committed to women's equality, is upset by this kind of information as I am, and I want to ask her what her department is doing to encourage equity in the civil service. I am assuming here that her department has been called upon to provide advice and to assist in promoting women, et cetera.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, I can tell the member that we, as a government, are very supportive of women taking decision-making positions within the civil service. In fact, since we took office in 1988, the percentage of women in senior officer and equivalent classification has increased from 17.85 percent to 23.87 percent in 1995, so that is an increase of 28.2 percent. In numerical terms, it means that in 1988, 78 of the total 437 positions were held by women; in 1995, there was a movement for 100 of those positions filled by women, an increase of 22 positions. In 1987, I would remind the member only 60 of 436 senior positions were filled by women. Just as an example of some of the senior positions, I understand in the civil service, again, 23.87 percent of senior officer and equivalent classifications were held by women in 1994. That is an increase of 6.46 percent from 1984. Number of deputy ministers in 1996 were three women, and assistant deputy ministers in 1996, there were eight women.
In addition to that, I think the member's point is that how do we encourage women and develop women to continue to take some of the more senior decision-making positions. The directorate is working with the Civil Service Commission on a strategy to develop women in executive management and also to look at interchange programs or stewardship programs which then will assist women and, hopefully, help them in developing the skills and also the desire to make application to some of those positions.
Ms. McGifford: Then employment equity is one of the areas that the directorate would see as a priority?
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, the answer is yes, and one of the staff people through the directorate is assigned to employment equity.
Ms. McGifford: I wonder if the minister could tell me if her government has ever considered pay equity legislation.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, I understand that there actually has been a fairly wide-scale application across public service in terms of the civil service, health care and education. To my knowledge, if the member is asking about an extension to the private sector, I am not aware of anything in that area at the moment.
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Ms. McGifford: I was thinking of the private sector.
As well, I wonder if the minister, in her capacity as the Status of Women, has ever urged her government to consider part-time benefits for part-time workers. I mention this because if one looks at the number of women in the province of Manitoba who are working part-time, I believe about half of the total working force of women in the province of Manitoba are working part-time, and, of course, many of these women have no benefits at all. I am assuming that in some cases they may. I do not have the statistics or figures at my fingertips, but it would seem to me that one way of promoting the status of women is always to put money in their pockets and to provide them with a strong social safety net. I wonder if the minister could comment on the question of part-time benefits for part-time workers. I guess what I mean is benefits for part-time workers.
Mrs. Vodrey: Certainly for the province of Manitoba as an employer, I understand that those benefits are in fact prorated at the moment. I am not aware of any possible changes to The Employment Standards Act which would compel the private sector to do this. I am not aware of that at the moment. I understand, however, that some private sector employers have on their own, without legislation, begun to look at prorating the benefits.
Ms. McGifford: I apologize for saying part-time benefits. I, of course, did not mean that at all; I meant benefits for part-time workers.
It may very well be that some private-sector employers have considered and, in fact, are providing their part-time employees with these benefits, but I wonder if the minister would consider advocating with her government on the question of benefits for part-time workers so that these could be legislated.
Mrs. Vodrey: At the moment I am not able to make a commitment to the member on a position in terms of a wide advocacy for this particular issue. I am aware in the private sector that we do want to make sure that there is employment, that we do want the private sector to generate employment, and, as we heard in Question Period today, where Manitoba's employment rates are significantly improved, that a large amount of that has been because there have been jobs created by the private sector.
So I think that it is important. Occasionally we have to work on one thing at a time, and one of the important initiatives of this government has been the creation of jobs and getting people back to work. That I think is being achieved, and we look for even more development in that area.
In terms of the province, I am very happy that the province has been able to set an example in this area and to show how this can work. I think that it would be an important discussion as more employment is developed. I think that it is still very important, and first and foremost important, to have the development and the creation of jobs so that women can become economically independent and start to have that benefit of working and not being part of--as has happened to many single mothers--simply to be part of a circle of remaining on welfare. So it is one thing at a time. It is certainly an area that I think deserves some further examination, but I am not able to commit today to taking that position.
Ms. McGifford: I notice the minister's comments on employment in the province of Manitoba, and I do not think the province of Manitoba is quite equal to the province of Saskatchewan with regard to employment rates. One thing that I do notice, too, is that while employment rates in Manitoba may have improved, child poverty rates in Manitoba really have not improved greatly. It would seem to me that one way of alleviating child poverty or helping child poverty a little bit would be, indeed, to legislate benefits for part-time workers so that when women are laid off--and a lot of the jobs the minister is talking about, a lot of the jobs created by her government, are seasonal jobs. For example, the garment industry. My understanding of the garment industry currently is that there are two really peak times in that industry when lots of people work, and then there are times of layoff. So it seems to me one way of alleviating some of the poverty that our children are experiencing would be to make sure that there is a little bit more money in the pockets of moms.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, well, I do not have the figures in front of me to offer anything further about our province versus Saskatchewan, but what I do remember is certainly the headlines recently where Manitoba is leading in the area of job creation. I think that is a very important statistic, and I think it is a very important number for a province, especially when we are coming out of a recession. For Manitoba to be positioning itself as a creator of jobs, to have the private sector as well being the creator of jobs and the sustainability of jobs--and in job creation you do not just look for what the party that the member belongs to did and that was some short-term government jobs with no sustainability, paid for only by public money--this government has attempted to set up a climate in which the private sector will be involved in job creation, where those jobs will be sustainable and where women will be the beneficiaries of a number of those jobs. So that has been the approach of our government.
Now the member has asked what I think is a reasonable question in the area of benefits in part-time work which many women have in fact been interested in. I believe she is probably basing some of her remarks--I am not sure--on a study which I think came out of the labour council in Ottawa. I remember recently reading the results of that. But, Mr. Chair, I think that we have to look at certain realities one step at a time, and I am very pleased that there has been an increase in the job creation side.
In terms of child poverty, our government is taking very, very active steps. We are participating in Taking Charge!. We are participating in education and training to help women remove themselves from that cycle of poverty. Also, Mr. Chair, in terms of child poverty, this government enacted the strongest maintenance enforcement legislation in this country to put more money in the pockets of mothers and children, where in the past there had been a default. That legislation has been copied almost completely by the federal government. We are very glad they did finally adopt it. This had been advocated for by our province for some time, and as our government said to the federal minister, these are the things that we know you can do to ensure the dollars, but this is what we will do in our province because we just cannot wait for you. We enacted it first. The federal government followed and, in addition to that, other provinces have followed, too.
So we are dealing with some of those issues which benefit women and their families through the areas of job creation, through the areas of education and training, through the areas of maintenance enforcement. I understand that since the introduction of the welfare reform program, there has been a decline of 676 in the caseload of single parents which is almost 95 percent women. I believe I had that statistic in my opening remarks. I also understand, and this is an important fact, 22.7 percent more social assistance recipients, or the actual number is 3,900, are reporting income now since the inception of Making Welfare Work.
So I do not hold that the single method which may assist women in their work and the child poverty rate is in fact the issue the member has raised. Our government has taken a very comprehensive approach sincerely working to make sure that women have economic security and that children who are not receiving the dollars that they should be receiving are, in fact, going to get them through legislation.
Ms. McGifford: Well, Mr. Chair, we certainly have come a long way in the last few minutes from the question originally raised. I think that benefits for part-time workers is a social justice issue, and I think it is appalling that we do not have them. As I said earlier in response to another set of questions, I think that there is always at least two opinions on every issue, and in this issue there are probably more than two. The minister and I, obviously, have grave disagreements.
One of the things that I am interested in asking the minister about is the whole Ministry for the Status of Women. I wonder if the minister's government has ever considered reviewing the Ministry of the Status of Women, considered changing or redefining the ministry so that it has more direct responsibility for issues that impinge directly on the lives of women, for example violence against women, child care, family disputes. I bring this issue up, because I know that in other jurisdictions, for example in B.C., there is a Ministry of Women's Equality which has many more responsibilities and powers than our Ministry for the Status of Women. Personally I like the idea of a strong ministry which has direct control over a range of programs affecting women. So I wanted to ask the minister to comment generally and specifically as to whether her government has considered or would consider in the future the concept of a women's ministry with increased power.
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Mrs. Vodrey: Well, I think it is always very difficult but sometimes useful to compare our Women's Directorate with the Ministry of Women's Equality and our Status of Women ministry with the Ministry of Women's Equality. My understanding is--I have been informed, and this is subject to clarification--that in fact they have downsized in British Columbia, that they in fact only have two priorities, violence against women and women's economic security.
I believe in our province the five areas of priority that our directorate is working on is working very well with the departments involved, is really doing a service for the people of Manitoba. I think that their work and the advisory council--B.C. does not have an advisory council. I understand that our advisory council is the only advisory council west of Quebec. So this government's commitment to women's issues and to making sure that we have vehicles in place to deal with them and also deal with them in a very comprehensive way I believe is quite effective.
I have to tell you, I am always impressed at the number of initiatives that directly affect the lives of women that have been able to be accomplished through the initiatives of this government through the Women's Directorate. It is the partnerships that have evolved as a result of the front line work which has been done. Keeping Safe at Work was one example; On the Move is another example. So we have a system in Manitoba, probably not perfect, but I believe effective in terms of the partnership and the actual work and also the way women's lives are in fact affected, I believe to the positive.
Ms. McGifford: Of course I was not addressing the work of either the Women's Directorate or the Manitoba Women's Advisory Council. I was suggesting that there are other ways, and we do not need to take B.C. as an example either. I am saying there are other possibilities for organizing a Ministry for the Status of Women.
One idea is to have in that jurisdiction more direct control, so that, and I am just thinking off the top of my head, violence against women's programming, instead of being funded through Family Services, would perhaps be funded through this ministry so that employment and training as it impinges on women may be funded through this ministry. These are just examples. I have not thought it through yet. I just personally like the idea of the minister having more power when it comes to issues that affect the lives and rights of women, and that was my question. Has the minister thought about this? Has the government thought about it? Has it been an issue in any of her discussions with her colleagues? That is my question.
Mrs. Vodrey: Well, it is an interesting idea, I have to say. The member said she is just developing it. So I guess, as I sit on the government side and I look at the responsibility of ministers charged with child care, for instance, and what an integration that is required for some of these issues, I am not sure that the model that she has suggested is in fact the most effective one. I have been informed that the B.C. model which did take responsibility for child care has in fact now handed that back though to what is their equivalent of the Minister of Family Services. They gave it a profile, sort of got things up and running, I understand, and now it has become again the responsibility of their Minister of Family Services or what that person's title is in British Columbia.
On the government side we operate through a number of committee opportunities, as well, in which as Minister for the Status of Women I sit actively on a number of committees which deal with policy development. So I have not had it raised to me that our model needs a specific kind of review. If the member has ideas, I am happy to listen to them.
Ms. McGifford: I am not sure the minister is finished. [interjection]
I wonder if the minister is familiar with the changes in the federal women's program, the one funded through the Secretary of State, Status of Women.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, yes, I am familiar with that.
Ms. McGifford: My understanding is that the changes were announced in March 1997, and my experience as a person who has worked in the women's community is that successive federal governments have tried to cut this program and others and sometimes the same have tried to make its funds almost impossible to access. I think the fund now is at $8.1 million for 1997-98, and I know that some 10 years ago the pool of money was $15 million. I am wondering whether the minister or the minister's staff have been working with Manitoba women's groups to determine what the effects of changes to this program might be on women's agencies, and especially those agencies which provide direct services to women as well as those that advocate on behalf of women.
Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, I am informed that Status of Women Canada does consultations across the country, and that we have in fact been kept informed of the results of those consultations. I am also told that Manitoba experienced no reductions in the change, and that Status of Women Canada is anxious to try and see that continues.
Ms. McGifford: Then, can the minister tell me if there have been future guarantees offered, because I know I have spoken to a number of women's groups in the community who are a little nervous about the possible implications of the changes.
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Mrs. Vodrey: I think the issue is that it is a federal one. It is a decision of the federal government, and we would want to make sure as Manitoba women that there was not anything further which occurred. We will have the opportunity both at the staff level and also at ministerial meetings. There was to be a ministerial meeting in another, I guess, two weeks, and that now has been cancelled as a result of the federal election. So we do not know yet what a new government, whoever that new government may be, how in fact they will be dealing with this issue. So at this point we have to wait and see what the position will be.
Ms. McGifford: I trust the minister and her staff will monitor this program and look for possible problems that changes in the program may cause Manitoba women's groups.
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, that is correct. I understand we do get a full breakdown every year, and I understand the most recent information has just come into the directorate.
Ms. McGifford: The minister has just told me that the meeting planned for early June or the end of May, whenever, in Nova Scotia, has been cancelled because of the federal election, but maybe I can ask my question in a different way. I wanted to ask the minister what issues she will take, and perhaps she could tell me which issues she would have taken if, indeed, the meeting had taken place.
Mrs. Vodrey: At this meeting some of the areas that Manitoba will be particularly involved in, first of all, is the CPP reform. We raised this issue last year when the ministers met, actually here in Manitoba, in Winnipeg, and it became one of the lead issues, and it was also very much an important issue for just about every other province. I have to say Status of Women ministers were--they just acted right away, many of us phoning our Finance ministers for information and so on, right at the time. So that will be one of the lead issues.
Certainly our position is to continue to encourage our proposal be adopted that ongoing mandatory credit splitting of the Canada Pension Plan credits between spouses be considered as part of the CPP reform. I understand it is to be part of round two, but any opportunity that we have to encourage that to continue, then we certainly will.
We will also be looking at issues of economic security for women. This has been, again, one of the ongoing areas of priority for Manitoba and also agreed upon as a priority by ministers for the Status of Women; access to justice issues as well for women. Another project which we have been working on, and I think is an important one, is the program of economic equality indicators for women, so that we can actually monitor the progress with some indicators which will apply to women's lives and can be broadly applied.
So those are some of the areas that have been areas of highlight for Manitoba.
Ms. McGifford: If I could refer to the press release from last year's conference and just read a couple of sentences from it: Continuing their efforts to strengthen and broaden the ability of girls and young women to make sound and strategic education and career choices, ministers agreed to pursue partnerships with the private sector to launch, in the coming year, a public awareness campaign designed to promote self-esteem and self-confidence among young women.
(Mrs. Shirley Render, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)
I wonder if the minister could provide some details on developments in Manitoba on this initiative.
Mrs. Vodrey: This was part of the national agenda. It was dependent upon co-operation and participation by some corporate sponsors. I understand there was some difficulty in that actually occurring, and I understand it is now not a part of the national agenda.
However, for Manitoba we have been interested in it and we have been pursuing it with, I am informed, Industry Canada, with school divisions, with relevant government departments, and we are looking to pursue this with some support on the Internet.
Ms. McGifford: When the minister attends one of these conferences, does the minister take staff with her?
Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, I am usually accompanied by the assistant deputy minister.
Ms. McGifford: I wanted to ask the minister a question about the federal Bill C-46, which is the bill known, I suppose commonly known, as the bill proceeding from the O'Connor case. I do not know whether the minister's channels of information are better than mine, but I am having a hard time discerning whether this bill was passed when the House rose or whether the bill will die on the Order Paper because it was not passed.
Mrs. Vodrey: I am told that staff do not at the moment know whether that bill has been passed. We will endeavour to find out. Certainly it was an important issue for women, it seems a very important issue, one in which I encouraged the federal Minister of Justice to adopt some extensions to as well and to not be quite so limiting simply in the area of sexual abuse, but also to consider areas of domestic violence as well, protection of files in the area of domestic violence.
(Mr. Ben Sveinson, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)
Ms. McGifford: Then I understand that while the minister supports the legislation, she, like me, is not completely convinced of the soundness of the legislation. She seems to find that the legislation is problematic in that it only deals with the records of victims of sexual violence and abuse without mentioning the victims of domestic abuse. Indeed I am gathering then that the minister believes those records should also be protected if individuals want them to be protected, because one of the things I understand from some women who work in domestic violence is, sometimes clients actually do want their records to be subpoenaed.
Mrs. Vodrey: Well, that is the position that our government has put forward. That was put forward before ministers for the Status of Women because, as Minister for the Status of Women, I wanted ministers to be able to speak to their Justice minister counterparts. In my previous portfolio as Minister of Justice, that was the position that our government put forward to the federal minister, Allan Rock.
I am also informed that the advisory council is seeking witness status before the federal Justice standing committee regarding this proposed legislation, and I understand you have not yet received and they have not received confirmation. When they called two weeks ago it was considered before the House, and of course there has been an election call, so we are not clear exactly as to the status of that bill at this point.
Ms. McGifford: Taking into consideration the information the minister has just given me, it would leave me to surmise almost certainly that the bill indeed has not been passed and may die on the Order Paper and may never come again, in which case I am also, as I am sure the minister is, concerned about the Carosella ruling, in which the Supreme Court threw out charges of gross indecency against one Nick Carosella because a rape crisis centre had destroyed a victim's personal counselling records. I am sure the minister agrees that this case really made the point that legislation is needed and needed right now. Yet it appears that this bill has not passed, so I wanted to ask the minister, after that long preamble: What plans does the minister have as soon as we do have an elected government in regard to this matter?
Mrs. Vodrey: Well, the first thing we have to do is to find the status of the bill at the moment, and that is what we will do. If the bill has not passed, then it should become a priority for the next federal government, whoever they are, and so at that point then I will undertake to write another letter to the federal Minister of Justice and the federal Minister for the Status of Women to ask that this be considered a priority by a new government.
Ms. McGifford: I have no more questions.
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The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Sveinson): 22.1. Status of Women (a) Manitoba Women's Advisory Council (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits $161,200--pass; (2) Other Expenditures $108,600--pass.
22.1.(b) Women's Directorate (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits $456,500--pass; (2) Other Expenditures $113,100--pass; (3) Grants $54,000--pass.
Resolution 22.1: RESOLVED that there be granted to Her Majesty a sum not exceeding $893,400 for the Status of Women for the fiscal year ending the 31st day of March, 1998.
That closes the Estimates of the Status of Women.
Ms. McGifford: I would just like to take the opportunity to thank the minister and her staff for being here and answering questions.
Mrs. Vodrey: On behalf of the staff and the people here I thank the member for that, and I know that it is very much appreciated.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Sveinson): Then that finishes the Estimates for the Status of Women.
The next Estimates inside the Chamber is Highways and Transportation. As of this moment we do not have anybody here, or the minister is not here, so we will take a very brief recess. As soon as they are, we will resume.
The committee recessed at 4:12 p.m.
The committee resumed at 4:17 p.m.