LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF
Monday, February 17, 1992
The House met at 8 p.m.
MATTER OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE
Mr. Speaker: The honourable member for
Ms.
Rosann Wowchuk (
There are specific areas that I would like
to raise. The Minister of Northern
Affairs (Mr. Downey) is, I believe, quite aware of one of them. In my constituency the people in one of the
communities, where there is an extremely high unemployment rate, have come up
with a proposal for a tourism development because they want to work. They want to come off welfare. They want to have the opportunity to develop
their community. That is a positive
suggestion.
I hope that the government will look at
this suggestion as well as other suggestions that have come from the people as
ideas on how we can create employment, how people can start to have faith in
their own communities and have some economic growth. For the government to say
that all we are talking about is just throwing money away, there is a way to
redirect the money and this government should seriously look at some of
those. As I say, I would be very pleased
if they would look at the idea that has come forward from my constituency.
Another area that has asked for some
economic development is the community of Rock Ridge, and again the Minister of
Northern Affairs is aware of this. These
people want to complete a subdivision.
The government would be required to put $12,000 into it in exchange for
a fairly substantial amount of money from the federal government, which again
would give economic growth to that community.
Maybe some of the jobs would be short term, but there would be some
training involved and a growth for the community. Again, look at those ideas.
Government also has to look at what they
are doing with our education system and opportunities they are taking away from
our children, particularly in the rural area, when they cut back on programs
that allow our children to get the technological skills that are required to
meet the opportunities of the challenging world facing us ahead. When you take away the opportunities, cut back
on programs, our rural children are not having the same opportunities as urban
children. I would hope the government would
be willing to invest and provide the proper training so these children‑‑our
rural children‑‑can take the same place in society in the
technological jobs that other children are having the opportunity to do.
These are not wasted dollars. It is not the theory of spending for
nothing. These will help our children
and help Manitobans. By training these
children, we will have the real opportunities to have the people trained to
take those jobs if we ever have the opportunity to attract them to this
province.
We are losing far too many of our‑‑the
government also talks about not wanting to spend money on creating jobs. We are losing our most precious
resource. Our young people are having to
leave this province because there are no opportunities here, very few. You look
at the number of people who have left from here and gone out to
* (2005)
Over the last week I met with LPNs and I
met with daycare workers who are extremely concerned with what this government
is doing with cutbacks in training again.
The cutbacks in these areas of training impact more on women than they
do on men, and it is having a worse effect on rural people. When the courses are not being offered out in
the rural area, you are setting people back. [interjection] My goodness, we can just about blame everything on
that, can we not?
Mr. Speaker, the other area that I am
extremely concerned about is the housing authority, this abandonment which this
government has said that they are doing to‑‑
Thank
you, Mr. Speaker.
Mrs.
Shirley Render (St. Vital): Mr.
Speaker, I really looked forward to this discussion this afternoon when the
honourable member for Flin Flon (Mr. Storie) rose earlier today and suggested
that we have an emergency debate on the economic situation in
I am afraid that I was not impressed with
what the members opposite have said, with the exception of the members from the
second party who have made some suggestions.
Although I am not too sure I agree with all their suggestions, I did
like the fact that they said let us work together.
I am afraid I am not impressed with the
members opposite, the official opposition.
It seems to me that the member for Flin Flon (Mr. Storie) said that the
government said there was no problem.
Mr. Speaker, I do not remember this government ever saying that the
economic situation in this province was no problem. In fact, when this government took over we
knew we had a problem even before the recession came, because we knew that this
province had higher taxation than any other province in the country.
Then I listened to the Leader of the
Opposition (Mr. Doer), and it seemed to me that he spent most of his time
literally gleefully talking about how wrong we were in forecasting the end of
the recession. It seemed to me that he
was more concerned with telling us all the negatives instead of saying
something about what we should be doing.
In fact, when I listened to all the members on the opposite side of the
House, I did not hear a single, solitary suggestion as to what this province
should be doing. All I heard was a lot
of whining, a lot of "you should not do this" and "you should
not do that." I did not hear a solid
suggestion as to what we really should be doing.
Since they cannot give us any suggestions,
I think maybe it is up to this side of the House just to reinforce and to
remind the members opposite just what this government has been doing. Since
1988 when we took office, this government has been laying a foundation for
growth. We have kept taxes down. We have worked to control the deficit. We have kept spending under control. I think it is interesting to note that the
federal government and seven other provinces in
I think it should also be pointed out to
members opposite that we have, and by we I am saying this government has worked
hard to build a solid foundation for economic growth. Some of the things that we have done have
been to repeal final offer selection which, I think, was a real blot on the
fair collective bargaining system. We
also brought in legislation to revise The Workers Compensation Act, and as all
of you know, that was first introduced in 1916 and there have been no major
revisions since then. Our revisions have
provided for a return to a balanced financial position and a more competitive
assessment rate, while at the same time helping the workers.
* (2010)
Now a little closer perhaps to home in what
we have done is the Workforce 2000 program.
This is the first year that this program has really been in operation,
and I think it should be noted by all that the Workforce 2000 program will be
offering Manitobans up to $8 million in private sector training initiatives as
well as training advisory and brokerage services. I do not have any hard and
fast figures with me today, but I understand that the program is up and running
and has trained hundreds of students.
I think one of the things that we have to
remember in this province is that we have to make our students and our
employees competitive, and that is what Workforce 2000 is doing. It is a way of government and employers
working together to provide Manitobans with a good variety of skills. Of course, that is the only way that
This government has also identified
strategic business and industrial developmental opportunities; I am thinking
mainly of the aerospace, environment, health, and information technology sectors. This province soon will be introducing
industrial requirement initiatives to help stimulate the expansion of the province's
industry and, of course, to attract new business.
I
think something that we have shown right from the very start is that we do
remain committed to economic development. That commitment, we are focusing on
innovations in the science and technology areas, such as the expansion or
reactivation of the Churchill research range.
Moving a little farther afield, we will be introducing a new oil and gas
act shortly.
(Mr. Marcel Laurendeau,
Acting Speaker, in the Chair)
Something else that we are going to be
tackling is a very aggressive tourism‑marketing program, and this will be
done, in partnership with industry and corporate sponsors, and this, of course,
will improve our position in the marketplace.
In fact, I think we will soon be announcing‑‑I expect that
we will be announcing‑‑a new Canada‑Manitoba tourism
agreement, which will stimulate the development and promotion of new tourism
products with international market appeal.
Many, many months ago, our Premier
travelled to
Now, something that we hear quite often
from members opposite is to create jobs.
Put money out there and create jobs.
Well, since May 1988 to October of this year, we have seen hundreds and hundreds
of business expansions and relocations here in
I just happen to have some figures here in
front of me. The government has
participated in some of this with repayable loans and grants, and they will
total just over $41 million. Now, if this
had been done under the old NDP Jobs Fund‑‑which the NDP, of course,
continues to suggest that we do, this is the way to generate economic growth‑‑the
creation of those 5,000 jobs would have cost the provincial treasury over $181
million, instead of the figure that I quoted just before. Of course, the problem with that is, it
really is just short‑term jobs with a long‑term debt attached to
it, and that is not what this government is interested in.
We have begun to put in place a new
structure for economic development in
*
(2015)
Now, this economic development board will
be serving as the key focal point of our government's efforts to encourage entrepreneurship,
economic growth, and job creation. This
board will be supported by a second element, I guess you could call it, the
Economic Development secretariat, and the third part of this partnership is the
formation of the Economic Innovation and Technology Council. This council, as some of you are aware, will include
representatives from the academic, business and labour sectors, as well as
appointments from the community at large. The first priority of this council
will be to review and evaluate current government and private sector
expenditures on innovation. Of course,
there are also a myriad of other things that the council will be doing.
Just to sum up really the strong point of
this council, I will simply say that the Economic Development Board will be working
to ensure that it is both the private and the public sector that the economic
development efforts of each of these areas is complementary to each other, that
neither will be working in isolation, that neither will have tunnel
vision. It is the development of a solid
working partnership or relationship between the private and the public sector,
which is what this government is promoting, and which will allow this province
to react quickly and effectively to capitalize on the economic opportunities as
they begin to develop.
Thank you, Mr. Acting Speaker.
Mr. Paul
Edwards (St. James): Mr. Acting
Speaker, it does give me pleasure to rise as we recommence or continue this
session for the first time. I want to
say that I find it particularly important and particularly gratifying to be
speaking so early on these very important economic issues which face our
province. Indeed, the province is in a deep recession that has plagued the country,
but we do not see the leadership from
We had hoped we would receive more
leadership from the provincial government quite frankly, because they have
always distanced themselves from the federal government as they should and have
talked of being an innovative government. We have been sorely disappointed in the lack
of innovation, the lack of free thinking on the part of the government. How ironic, however, that this comes forward
in the form of a matter of urgent public interest from the New Democratic
Party.
I heard in the preamble, it was mentioned
some 57,000 jobs; well, that may be. My
question is, have they factored in the however many are out on the street, as
we speak, at their headquarters? There
are a few more people out of work‑‑[interjection]. It might be
57,009 or 10. I do not know that their
figure is accurate and I would like a verification of the exact figure, because
they know it. Believe me, they know it. Even out of power, the NDP have a knack for
putting people out of work. It is
unbelievable. Is there any more telling
tale of why they are not in power and never should be in power, Mr. Acting
Speaker? For members' benefit, I was at
the site of the pickets and I want to just put on the record some of the horrendous
employer abuses of authority which are being called to the attention on the
picket line‑‑the withdrawal of maternity benefits.
Some
Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr.
Edwards: Yes, they have decided to
move away from 100 percent funding and fall back on the UIC regime, the UIC
regime which they have roundly criticized does not represent 100 percent compensation. No. 2, contracting out. Of all the employers' sins, they are
contracting out it appears, Mr. Acting Speaker. It is frankly hard to
believe. Hypocrisy has reached new
highs, I am afraid. Wait, there is a
third, and quite possibly the most damning, cutbacks in wages. Those are the allegations which are being
made. I am not at the negotiating table,
but who am I to question those who picket and know the issues best and who
raise those three issues on the signs as they picket right here in this city.
* (2020)
Mr. Acting Speaker, I want to know who is
negotiating for the NDP. Is it Eugene
Kostyra out of retirement? I think he
knows the skills. Is it perhaps the
former member for Churchill, perhaps the Leader of the NDP himself. He knows all the tricks and has certainly got
the skills. He has indicated many times
he has been at the negotiating table.
Well, he is at it now.
Mr. Acting Speaker, this is the party that
runs to join every picket line in the province wherever it is. Whatever the issue, the New Democratic Party
has consistently run for the picket line.
Where is the reporter? Where is
the picket line? I am in. Well, as I say, we have learned of the new
heights of hypocrisy to which the New Democratic Party will go, and so while I
am not surprised, I am a bit surprised at the shamelessness with which they
come forward today and complain entirely and put the blame entirely on others
for the loss of work in this province.
Having said that, there is no question that the government deserves much
of the blame for the current state of affairs in this province.
Mr. Acting Speaker, the challenge was
put. Where are the solutions? That was the challenge that was put by the
Minister of Finance (Mr. Manness). Let
me take these brief few minutes to put forward a few. First and foremost, the Conservative government
must abandon the trickle‑down theory of economics. That is the theory by
which the decisions are made here and in
Today, as we speak, in
The government knows and has indicated many
times the swelling of the welfare roles.
Well, how is it going to help that we are going to continue to have
business‑‑ultimately, I believe, business may believe in
In
* (2025)
Another solution, Mr. Acting Speaker, we
need a labour adjustment strategy. I
have talked about this for years and years.
It is high time that the government started to come through on the
commitments it made when we went into the Free Trade Agreement. The government said at that time, as you will
recall, as they were leading us into the Free Trade Agreement: Do not
worry. We understand that the average
Canadian worker will have four or five job changes in their career. We wrote a whole book on it called the de
Grandpre Report.
Mr. Acting Speaker, that report indicated
very clearly the absolutely essential nature of a labour adjustment strategy if
we were even possibly to win under the Free Trade Agreement. Have we seen it? We have seen a pittance. We have seen words and no action. There is no consistent, cohesive labour
adjustment strategy in this country, let alone in this province. So that is solution No. 2.
Solution No. 3, Mr. Acting Speaker. Take another look at where this government is
going. I see the Minister of the Environment
(Mr. Cummings) here and I want him to take another look at Conawapa.
Mr. Acting Speaker, we have on the record
now indications that the projections which Conawapa was approved by‑‑
The
Acting Speaker (Mr. Laurendeau):
Order, please.
Mr.
Oscar Lathlin (The Pas): Mr. Acting
Speaker, I also appreciate the opportunity to be able to rise today to speak on
a very critical issue that is facing all Manitobans today. I am not going to be quoting you statistics,
because we all know what they are. We
know what the numbers are, and this government knows very well what those
numbers are as well, so I am not going to bother giving you numbers and
statistics.
What I would like to, instead, talk about,
Mr. Acting Speaker, is touch on the human cost that this government and its policies
are inflicting on the citizens of
Recently, I had the opportunity to visit
the communities in my constituency and talk to the community leaders, the
business people, the workers, the elders, and the young people. I must say that the mood of the people I
visited has not changed at all from the time that I last visited them, which
was in the late spring. That mood is one
of despair, fear, hopelessness and anger.
I also very clearly recognize the feeling
of people who were wanting to give up or who, in some cases, were already
giving up‑‑people who were laid off from their place of employment,
people who were forced onto UI benefits and onto welfare. I think that is an extremely sad
situation. It makes me sad anyway as I
travel around the North visiting the people who reside there.
* (2030)
It is extremely sad, because when people
allow themselves or who are forced to get to that point, when people are no
longer feeling good about themselves and feeling depressed and, yes, in some
cases, even blaming themselves for being in a situation that they find
themselves in. The family unit begins to
disintegrate, and the social breakdown, of course, inevitably begins to manifest
itself in the community.
The crime rate goes up. I think all of us know that. You do not have to be a social worker to know
that. All one has to do is have common
sense. Read the police reports and the
evidence is very clear. The abuse of
drugs and alcohol worsens, families break up, family violence increases, as the
Minister of Justice (Mr. McCrae) was trying to point out to me a while ago, and
in the end the cost of the government far outweighs the cost‑cutting measures
that this government so steadfastly adheres to.
This is an incredibly high human cost to pay, yet this government says
it is proud of what it has done, it is proud of what it is doing.
In spite of what this government is doing
to the North, the spirit of those people will not be broken, I can guarantee
that. They will continue to survive.
This deplorable situation, Mr. Acting Speaker, is, of course, not unique
to the North, as a result of this Conservative government's policy.
The despair is being felt all over the
province, but what I wanted to emphasize is that when this government is trying
to determine the pulse of
The province is not only comprised of the
South; it also includes the northern part of the province. The unemployment rate, the amount of social
assistance that is being issued in
I think I can understand maybe why things
are always worse in the North, and I will give you three reasons. For one thing, this government has gone on
record in this Chamber that the North is to be ridiculed and belittled. The Minister of Northern Affairs (Mr. Downey)
not too long ago has told this Assembly that the North just did not know how to
vote. So that shows us how much
commitment and how sensitive the minister is towards the needs of the North.
The other reason that I can think of is that
the majority of the approximately one million people live in the South, and
that is where the vote is. That is one
reality that the people from the North have to live with, unfortunately. The other reason, my final reason, for this
apparent neglect for the North, which I often think about, Mr. Acting Speaker,
is that in the Northern Affairs area the majority of the population comprises
of aboriginal people.
Now, Mr. Acting Speaker, I happen to know
where the aboriginal people stand in this government's agenda. This government has never had the intention
to enhance the growth and development of aboriginal people. All we have to do is look at its track
record. The other thing that one has to
do, besides looking at this government's track record and its dealing with aboriginal
people, is to look at all those programs which were funded by way of federal‑provincial
agreements. Programs, such as ACCESS,
the Northern Development Agreement, just to name two, were done away with while
this government stood idly by saying absolutely nothing.
As if that were not enough, Mr. Acting
Speaker, this government proceeded to cut the budgets and lay off workers at KCC,
Natural Resources and other employment and training programs in the North. The other thing that this government always
does is: It is the federal government,
it is the international situation, it is what is happening in other provinces,
but you know, who is the government of
When George Petty flew into town some time
in the spring of 1989, there was much hullabaloo about all the benefits that
Repap was going to bring, jobs and wealth.
Today, after three years, Repap has yet to deliver anything in the way
of additional jobs, and worse, it has nothing in its forecast in the way of additional
jobs for the next three or four years.
This is what Repap officials tell me when I visit them in The Pas. What we have instead is a reduced work force
at The Pas and workers who are being laid off every two or three months, yet
this government will stand here and tell this Chamber that it is proud of what
it has been able to do through Repap.
The Northern Economic Development Commission‑‑
The
Acting Speaker (Mr. Laurendeau):
Order, please. Time is up.
Hon.
James Downey (Minister of Energy and Mines): Mr. Acting Speaker, I rise to participate in
this debate which, by the appearance today, caught the opposition somewhat by
surprise, I think. To hear the speeches,
either they were not prepared or they are not serious about the emergency
debate which they brought before this Assembly.
I want to just touch briefly on a couple of
issues. First of all, I want to
acknowledge the hard work and effort of the previous Minister of Energy and
Mines, who is in the House tonight, and his sincere effort to put forward
policies and programs to encourage the mining industry in this province and to deal
with the energy issues.
I realize that 10 minutes goes very
quickly, so maybe we should go for a rule change and give us a little more time
when we are on matters of such importance to the province. Our message is good; it is clear. I want to talk particularly as it relates to
two areas. One is a brief one on
history, and the other is what we are doing and where I think we should be
going as a province.
First of all, let us look at the whole
energy question and
Let us just take a look at the history of
it. We had a Premier who, I believe, had
a lot of vision and foresight in the development of rural hydro‑electrification,
and that was in the person of D.L. Campbell.
Why did D.L. Campbell develop rural electrification? Because it was the right thing to do. It was the right thing to do to help the
economy of rural
What followed that was the vision of Duff
Roblin, with the further development of hydro‑electric power on the
* (2040)
That was thrown out by the NDP government
of Howard Pawley, the creation of jobs due to the electricity development in Manitoba‑‑followed
by the Howard Pawley government who said what?
We should build more dams in the North, we should build Limestone, we
should speed up the development of the Limestone Generating Station, supported
again by the people of
The election of the Filmon government: What has changed, Mr. Acting Speaker? I think the people of
Secondly, we said it should go through the
most extensive environmental process available and known today, federally and provincially. Yes, Mr. Acting Speaker, and that is a
process that is in place. What has
changed are two processes.
The theme of the Leader of the Opposition
(Mr. Doer) today was this: We need to do
something about the economy and create jobs, jobs, jobs. His words, Mr. Acting Speaker, his words in 1989,
and notice how he has shifted. The
Leader of the New Democratic Party said in 1989, this is what he said, he was supportive
of Conawapa project when it was first announced in 1989. In fact, he claimed Premier Pawley's NDP
government had signed an agreement between
In fact, he projected 30,000 to 35,000
person years of employment over its 10 year construction schedule. This is the Leader of the New Democratic
Party. Here is what he said as well;
this was on April 6, 1988: Hydro is one
of the greatest resources, and we will continue to be committed to the orderly development
of our
An
Honourable Member: Who said that?
Mr.
Downey: The Leader of the New
Democratic Party. Again, he reiterated
in the Budget Debate of 1988, and this is partially what he said: And we will fight the mothballing of our
Manitoba Hydro program right down the line this session and the next session of
the Legislature.
He would fight the mothballing of
Conawapa. That is what he was going to
do. He further said: The economic realities are very important,
but we must consider the environment.
Oh, there is something starting to change
here. We must consider the environment
as also very important in our deliberation and make it the No. 1 priority.
That is a change. We started to feel a little shift coming in
the New Democratic Party position, from mothballing now to saying the
environment is No. 1. There must have
been some shifting in the political winds.
It must have been something for the opportunism of the Leader of the New
Democratic Party. Here is what he
further said, and this is November 15 of 1990.
He is asking the minister: Will
the government assure us that there will be no construction until all licences
that are necessary are issued provincially and federally?
What licences did the New Democratic Party
have in place for the building of Limestone, for the building of the any of the
dams that he was involved with?
Absolutely none. We have now seen
again, in the
I challenge the member for Thompson (Mr.
Ashton), The Pas (Mr. Lathlin), Rupertsland (Mr. Harper) and Churchill. I challenge the member for Flin Flon (Mr.
Storie) and also the member who used to live in Churchill. What is his position? Well, I will tell you
what his position was. Let us go to the position
of Mr. Hickes. This was the position of
Mr. Hickes: I want to ask the Minister
of Energy and Mines, considering his personal views on affirmative action, what
consultation and planning is now going on to ensure northerners get these opportunities
again with Conawapa.
He wants his people to have‑‑the
question was put directly, NDP MLA Mr. Hickes, who is the NDP Energy critic who
voiced his support for Conawapa during the 1990 Budget Debate. He said, when the question was put: yes, I do support it. You see, an honest man. The member for Flin Flon (Mr. Storie), what
did the member for Flin Flon say in July 1988?
I hope that the new Minister responsible for Hydro, meaning Mr. Neufeld,
and the new chairperson of the Manitoba Hydro will not let the opportunity pass
to continue to develop our hydro resource.
The bottom line is this. The members from northern
It is time to challenge their Leader. Are they going to take the side of the
northerners and the Natives for job creation and economic development, or are
they going to say, we are not prepared to stand up and live up to our beliefs?
Mr. Acting Speaker, I can assure you that
there is a proper process in place. We
expect it to be followed but we expect‑‑
The Acting
Speaker (Mr. Laurendeau): Order,
please.
Mr.
Downey: ‑‑the Leader of
the New Democratic Party (Mr. Doer) and the members of his party to stand up
and be counted when it comes to the important issues in this province.
Mr.
Kevin Lamoureux (
Mr. Acting Speaker, I want to accept the
challenge of the Minister of Finance (Mr. Manness) and, as I have stated in speaking
to the motion, that this debate is necessary and it was very important that
members stood up in the House and made some positive suggestions, some
recommendations to contribute to try to turn things around.
The free trade deal, no doubt, has had a
major impact on
* (2050)
I want to talk very briefly about a program
that was just brought to my attention the other day, a program that was, in fact,
being cut in an inadvertent fashion, and that is called the RRAP program. RRAP stands for the Residential
Rehabilitation Assistance Program. In a
nutshell, it is a program that allows homeowners to improve their house through
applying for grants, through applying for loans, loan forgiveness. It is a joint program that the City of
In this particular instance, the number of
inspectors are being cut back. As a
direct result, there are not going to be as many applications being processed. There will not be as many applications being
approved. Thereby, we are going to
have: 1) jobs are going to be lost; and
2) revitalization is very important to all of our urban and rural areas, and it
is not going to help out the whole question of revitalizing our older communities.
I use this as an example that the
government through each and every department has a multitude of different
programs, that if they were to look into each program and come up with ideas or
new initiatives, because they have the resources, we know that, to look at the
different programs, to enhance the programs that are already within, to
possibly come up with additional programs such as one that was cut back with
the Department of Housing regarding the housing co‑op HomeStart Program.
These are all programs that contributed not
only direct jobs, they also provided indirect jobs, and these were permanent
jobs in the sense that they were training jobs.
These are jobs that we have right now.
Currently, a very high percentage of unemployed‑‑the Premier
(Mr. Filmon) himself has often talked about the importance of creating
construction work, construction jobs.
There are a good number of jobs in that area, in the housing co‑ops. I have always been an advocate of converting non‑profit
housing into housing co‑ops, wherever possible, and the government really
has not acted on what I believe is an excellent resolution, that was introduced
a session ago. [interjection]
By the Liberal Party, to the Minister of
Health. The Liberal Party has
contributed in many different ways by bringing forward resolutions, as we have
seen today, with bills, coming up with very positive ideas and, to the
government's credit, they have actually adopted a couple of them. I believe that there are some other
resolutions that are out there that would provide the jobs, that would not
necessarily cost money.
We talk about the housing co‑op. By having the non‑profit housing turn
into housing co‑ops, you are giving an individual the opportunity to own
their home, to have better‑‑I would suggest that home‑owners,
co‑op members, take very good care of their premises, will do more work
inside their premises, creating more demand for different products, and so
forth.
When I think in terms of the Minister of
Health (Mr. Orchard)‑‑because the Minister of Health quite often
asks for positive suggestions and ideas in terms of how he might better be able
to spend our tax dollars‑‑I believe, and I know the Minister of
Health is taking advantage of the leader of the Liberal Party's comments out at
Minnedosa in regard to personal care homes.
There is a demand for personal care homes in the city and in some areas
in rural Manitoba‑‑
An
Honourable Member: What did she
say? I forget. What did she say?
Mr.
Lamoureux: ‑‑and this
might be an opportune time for the government to invest into expanding their
personal care homes.
The Deputy Premier (Mr. Downey) asks, what
is it that she said? Well, in fact, I
was there, and the Deputy Premier‑‑
Point of Order
The Acting Speaker (Mr.
Laurendeau): Order, please.
Hon.
Harold Gilleshammer (Minister of Family Services): Thank you, Mr. Acting Speaker. I think the people of Minnedosa would really
like to have some clarification of that comment on turfing 50 percent of the
people out of the personal care homes.
They certainly felt she meant it.
The
Acting Speaker (Mr. Laurendeau):
Order, please. The honourable
minister did not have a point of order.
* * *
Mr.
Lamoureux: Mr. Acting Speaker, I
hope that time will be taken off and that I will be given back another two
minutes anyway. I would like to make
quick reference. The Leader of the Liberal
Party (Mrs. Carstairs) does not believe that you should hold seniors in a
health institution if you do not have to, unlike the government. If the government says to the seniors that
they have to stay in a health‑care facility, whether it is the
If that is the message that they want to
send out to Manitobans, that is fine, but I will tell you that is not in the best
interests of our seniors. If the seniors
that are in the health‑care institutions feel that they would be better
served in a personal care home and the minister does not want to open his eyes
to realize and to listen to what the seniors are in fact saying, well, that is
his problem. It is a very valid
suggestion that the Leader of the Liberal Party (Mrs. Carstairs) had brought forward. Unfortunately, members and ministers have
attempted to take advantage and to blow it out of proportion and misquote. They
were not there, and I am telling you I was there. I did listen to what the Leader of the
Liberal Party was saying, and that was the gist of it.
Mr. Acting Speaker, there are things that
the government can do that will improve the lifestyles of all Manitobans and creating
jobs is one of the major issues in my riding.
I had a survey that went out just about eight‑nine months ago, and
in tabulating the results‑‑every Premier wants me to table it. The Premier (Mr. Filmon) likely already has a
copy of it. He had a copy of my previous
ones, and if he does not, the Premier can ask me, and I will be more than happy
to share with him the results. If the Premier or the Deputy Premier (Mr.
Downey) wants to come and sit down with me, I would be more than happy to
review it, because I do not mind sharing the concerns of my constituents if I
feel that the government is in fact going to take them very seriously.
I see the light is flashing, and I do want
to just conclude by saying‑‑[interjection]
If there is leave I will be more than happy to.
To conclude, the government's ideas in the past two, two and a half
years have not been working in attempting to get the economy in
The
Acting Speaker (Mr. Laurendeau):
Order, please.
Mr.
Edward Connery (
(Mrs. Louise Dacquay,
Deputy Speaker, in the Chair)
Madam Deputy Speaker, when they were in
government, they were void of any ideas as to how to create jobs except through
the Jobs Fund, which cost us something like $250 million and really did not
create‑‑maybe a handful of full‑time jobs.
Madam Deputy Speaker, that is not the way
to go. We have to talk about long‑term
jobs that are going to be paid for by the purchasers of those goods. I respect the member for
The member for
* (2100)
I would also like to point out the
upgrading of HBM&S at Flin Flon, which the NDP had not moved on, but now we
are funding. It took quite a while of
negotiation, and I have to say to the department, thank God, we have got
it. Now it is going to do something
substantial for Flin Flon. It is going
to ensure that the North survives. The
member for The Pas (Mr. Lathlin), I guess, does not want to hear these
comments, but he should, because those are jobs for the northern people. I think that was a major thrust, costing a
lot of money, Manitobans' money, and I think it was in the right direction.
Madam Deputy Speaker, job creation is many
faceted, and I agree with what our government has done in trying to bring in place
the deficit to get our spending under control to create an environment that
business will want to come to this province and invest. When you have a runaway deficit, a runaway
inflation, you are not going to have businesses come to this province.
We talk about little job creations, and the
member for The Pas (Mr. Lathlin) was complaining about they did not have enough
tree planting at their project at The Pas.
I want to say, through the NDP years, the Dakota Plains Reserve just
southwest of
The NDP would not give them a contract to
grow trees. When we got into government,
I worked with the department, and I want to thank the member for
Madam Deputy Speaker, I have not heard one
word mentioned today about tourism. Tourism
can be one of the greatest generators of job creation that we can have. I am not going to be critical of the minister
who has tourism, because I have said many times in this House already, that the
minister is an excellent minister, he has too many portfolios to look after,
and he cannot do them all well. I see
him here at seven o'clock in the morning when I come early, and he is here late
at night, and he is here on the weekends, so members opposite do not need to say
anything. That minister is working as
hard as he can.
We do need, I believe, a separate
department for tourism, where we can have some emphasis put on it, where people
can go out and work with the industry and have the time to listen to them and
to create something that, I think, is well worthwhile, but you can remember the
thrust of the NDP when they were in power.
Do you remember the World Expo in
An
Honourable Member: Not all the
provinces.
Mr.
Connery: Well, the western provinces
did. We were the laughingstock at
Expo. We were ashamed to tell the people
of the world what we had. Members talk
about the beauty of the North. We had people from all over the world coming to
Madam Deputy Speaker, the greatest thrust
that I think we can do as a province for job creation is to divert water from
the
It is also going to require support from
your party, the NDP party, to allow us to do that. I would hope that the member for Radisson
(Ms. Cerilli), who is the environmental critic, would listen, because she did
canoe down the
Madam Deputy Speaker, if we divert water to
that very rich southern
The member for‑‑where is he
from?‑‑Reverend Blackjack from Burrows‑‑
Point of Order
Mr. Steve Ashton
(Opposition House Leader): I would like to ask you
to call the member to order. It is one
of the clearer customs in this House and as part of our rules that all members refer
to‑‑as honourable members, they are referred to as the honourable
member for a particular constituency. It
is not in order for members to get up and use terms such as that when referring
to a member. I would like to ask you to
have the member withdraw that and resume with a more normal way of addressing
members in this House.
Mr.
Connery: I would be glad to withdraw
the comment in the context that they are objecting to, but the phrase
"Blackjack" came because he was walking with the casino strikers, and
he is supposedly opposed to gambling.
That is the only reason we use that, Madam Deputy Speaker.
* * *
Mr.
Connery: I would hope that members
opposite would support this government when we come to bring proposals forward
for the diversion of water, not only for the