LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA

 

Monday, May 16, 2005

 


The House met at 1:30 p.m.

 

PRAYERS

 

ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS

 

PETITIONS

 

Riverdale Health Centre

 

Mrs. Leanne Rowat (Minnedosa): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.

 

      These are the reasons for the petition:

 

      The Riverdale Health Centre services a population of approximately 2000, including the Town of Rivers and the R.M. of Daly, as well as the Sioux Valley First Nation and local Hutterite colonies.

 

      The need for renovation or repair of the Riverdale Health Centre was identified in 1999 by the Marquette Regional Health Authority (RHA) and was the No. 1 priority listed in the RHA's 2002-2003 Operational Plan.

 

      To date, the community has raised over $460,000 towards the renovation or repair of the health centre.

 

      On June 1, 2003, the Premier (Mr. Doer) made a commitment to the community of Rivers that he would not close or downgrade the services available at Riverdale Health Centre.

 

      Due to physician shortages, the Riverdale Health Centre has been closed to acute care and emergency services for long periods since December 2003, forcing community members to travel to Brandon or elsewhere for health care services.

 

      We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

 

      To urge the Premier to consider ensuring that acute care and emergency services are available to the residents of Rivers and surrounding areas in their local hospital and to live up to his promise to not close the Rivers Hospital.

 

      To request that the Minister of Health (Mr. Sale) consider developing a long-term solution to the chronic shortages of front line health care profes­sionals in rural Manitoba.

 

      This petition has been signed by Cam White, Yvonne Swayze, Carole Hodkin and others.

 

Mr. Speaker: In accordance with our Rule 132(6), when petitions are read they are deemed to be received by the House.

 

Coverage of Insulin Pumps

 

Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Steinbach): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.

 

      These are the reasons for this petition:

 

      Insulin pumps cost over $6,500.

 

      The cost of diabetes to the Manitoba government in 2005 will be approximately $214.4 million. Each day 16 Manitobans are diagnosed with the disease compared to the national average of 11 new cases daily.

 

      Good blood sugar control reduces or eliminates kidney failure by 50 percent, blindness by 76 per­cent, nerve damage by 60 percent, cardiac disease by 35 percent and even amputations.

     

      Diabetes is an epidemic in our province and will become an unprecedented drain on our struggling health care system if we do not take action now.

 

      The benefit of having an insulin pump is it allows the person living with this life-altering disease to obtain good control of their blood sugar and become much healthier, complication-free individuals.

 

      We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

 

      To request the Premier (Mr. Doer) of Manitoba to consider covering the cost of insulin pumps that are prescribed by an endocrinologist or medical doctor under the Manitoba Health Insurance Plan.

 

      This petition is signed by April Kreutz, Lisa Rempel, Guy Pambrun and many, many others.

 

* (13:35)

 

Pembina Trails School Division–New High School

 

Mr. John Loewen (Fort Whyte): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.

 

      These are the reasons for this petition:

 

      Overcrowded schools throughout Whyte Ridge, Lindenwoods, Linden Ridge and Richmond West subdivisions are forcing Pembina Trails School Division to bus students outside of these areas to attend classes in the public school system.

 

      Elementary schools in Pembina Trails School Division have run out of space to accommodate the growing population of students in the afore­mentioned areas.

 

      Five-year projections for enrolment in the elementary schools in these areas indicate significant continued growth.

 

      Existing high schools that receive students from Whyte Ridge, Lindenwoods and Linden Ridge are at capacity and cannot accommodate the growing number of students that will continue to branch out of these subdivisions.

 

      Bussing to outlying areas is not a viable long-term solution to meeting the student population growth in the southwest portion of Winnipeg.

 

      The development of Waverley West will increase the need for a high school in the southwest sector of Winnipeg.

 

      The government is demonstrating a lack of respect for the students and families in Whyte Ridge, Lindenwoods, Linden Ridge and Richmond West by refusing to provide adequate access to education within the community.

 

      The Fort Whyte constituency is the only constituency in the province that does not have a public high school.

      NDP constituencies in Winnipeg continue to receive capital funding for various school projects while critical overcrowding exists in schools in Lindenwoods, Whyte Ridge and Richmond West.

 

      We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

 

      To request the provincial government recognize the need for a public high school in the southwest region of Winnipeg.

 

      To request the provincial government, in conjunction with the Public Schools Finance Board, to consider adequate funding to establish a high school in the southwest sector of Winnipeg.

 

      Signed by Tim Green, Kathryn Drummond, David Drummond and many, many others.

 

Ambulance Service

 

Mr. Ron Schuler (Springfield): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.

 

      These are the reasons for this petition:

 

      In May 2004, 46-year-old Peter Krahn suffered a heart attack while exercising in East St. Paul and was pronounced dead just under an hour later after being transported to the Concordia Hospital in Winnipeg. Reports show that it took nearly 18 minutes for an ambulance to arrive for Mr. Krahn.

 

      The Interlake Regional Health Authority claims that 21 minutes is an acceptable emergency response time, whereas the City of Winnipeg uses a bench­mark of 4 minutes.

 

      Ambulance coverage for East St. Paul is provided from Selkirk, which is almost 25 kilometres away.

 

      The municipalities of East St. Paul and West St. Paul combined have over 12 000 residents.

 

      We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

 

      To request the provincial government to consider providing East St. Paul with local ambu­lance service which would service both East and West St. Paul.

      To request the provincial government to consider improving the way that ambulance service is supplied to all Manitobans by utilizing tech­nologies such as GPS in conjunction with a Medical Transportation Co-ordination Centre (MTCC) which will ensure that patients receive the nearest ambulance in the least amount of time.

 

      To request the provincial government to consider ensuring that appropriate funding is provided to maintain superior response times and sustainable services.

 

      Signed by Heidi Anders, Janis Warkentin, Sabine Gregg and many, many others.

 

* (13:40)

 

Generally Accepted Accounting Principles

 

Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.

 

      The background to this petition is as follows:

 

      Manitoba's provincial auditor has stated that Manitoba's 2003-2004 budget deficit was the second highest on record at $604 million.

 

      The provincial government is misleading the public by saying they had a surplus of $13 million in the 2003-2004 budget.

 

      The provincial auditor has indicated that the $13-million surplus the government says it had cannot be justified.

 

      The provincial auditor has also indicated that the Province is using its own made up accounting rules in order to show a surplus instead of using generally accepted accounting principles.

 

      We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:

 

      To request the provincial government to consider adopting generally accepted accounting principles in reporting Manitoba's budgetary numbers.

 

      Signed by Chue Mansilla, Florence Pabon and Renato Dimatulac.

ORAL QUESTIONS

 

Crocus Fund

Government-Appointed Director

 

Mr. Stuart Murray (Leader of the Official Opposition): Mr. Speaker, last Friday it was reported that Crocus had appointed five new board directors leaving this government's appointee, Mr. Ron Waugh, as the lone remaining, conflicted board member. This government's appointee knew shares were overvalued in September, he knew they were overvalued in November. Despite that this NDP government continued to use taxpayers' dollars to extensively promote Crocus as a good investment for hardworking Manitobans.

 

      Mr. Speaker, this government's political appointee is the only one left who is connected to the selling of overvalued shares. Will this Premier use his authority to replace Mr. Waugh with an experi­enced director who is not distracted by a threat of a lawsuit or subject to various serious allegations by the Manitoba Securities Commission? Will he do that today?

 

Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, it gives me an opportunity to clarify again the record. There has been an instance of promotion of the Crocus shares in the public service, obviously with a subsidy of the taxpayers. In the 1997 period, the government then issued promotional material in pay stubs and pay envelopes of civil servants. The Securities Commission determined that was outside of the prospectus where the body of government should be independent of individual decisions. We, when we were informed of that, stopped it.

 

Mr. Murray: Well, Mr. Speaker, I hope the Premier will attempt to try to answer the question. Since September 2004, hardworking Manitobans continued to invest in overvalued Crocus shares. During that time period, from September to December, one third of that investment was lost. In fact, overall since September, some $60 million in retirement savings have been completely wiped out.

 

      Mr. Speaker, Crocus investors have lost confidence in this NDP government's representative. Will the Premier use his authority to replace his conflicted political appointee with an experienced director who is not distracted by the threat of a lawsuit or subject to serious allegations by the Manitoba Securities Commission? Will he listen to this question and answer it?

 

Mr. Doer: The individual is not a quote "political appointee." I do not believe he is a quote "member of any political party," nor has he donated funds to any political party. There have been some in the past that have been members of parties and donated money to political parties, but that certainly has not happened since 1999.

 

      Mr. Speaker, I would point out some of the major issues raised by Martin Cash and other analysts on investments in Crocus, co-investments between the provincial government and the Crocus Fund: Isobord, some $23 million lost by the pro­vincial government and a considerable $7-million loss by the Crocus Fund; Westsun, $4,400,000 lost by the provincial government, some-$21 million in a co-investment loss by Crocus Fund. That investment was made in 1997-98. The Isobord announcement was made, in fact, including by member opposite when he was in Cabinet, in 1997-88. Winnport Logistics, some $5.9 million, losses for Crocus, $6.7 million.

 

      Mr. Speaker, those major problems took place before we were elected. We do trust that the Auditor and the Securities Commission will be dealing with all the facts.

 

* (13:45)

 

Public Inquiry

 

Mr. Stuart Murray (Leader of the Official Opposition): Unfortunately, Mr. Speaker, that attempt to deflect the real issue does nothing to 33 000 Manitoba stakeholders and Manitoba taxpayers.

 

      Mr. Speaker, this Premier's refusal to replace his politically appointed representative on the Crocus Board shows his complete disregard for the best interest of shareholders and the taxpayers of Mani­toba. The NDP government has failed in its responsibility to monitor the Crocus Fund and, in turn, has failed the 33 000 shareholders who have taken a significant loss on their hard-earned savings. This Premier should replace his government representative today and commit to full disclosure of the facts.

 

      Mr. Speaker, will this Premier give his commitment today? We know that the Auditor General is looking at this. We know the Manitoba Securities will also be looking at it, but if this Premier were honest with Manitobans he would stand in his place and acknowledge that those investigations are limited in scope. If he truly wants to get to the bottom of this he will do the right thing and call for an independent public inquiry so the truth will come out.

 

Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, we have a body called the Securities Commission that has the authority of the Court of Queen's Bench. We have the provincial Auditor General that is dealing with this matter. Members opposite have not even seen the results of those–

 

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

 

Mr. Speaker: Order.

 

Mr. Doer: As I understand it, the Securities Commission has not completed its work, Mr. Speaker. It has not come to final conclusions. There are other organizations looking at this. There are new members of the board of directors: Miss Carol Bellringer, Miss Darlene Dziewit, Mr. Jim Husiak, Miss Gillenny, Ms. Leney Richardson, Mr. Van Hall.

 

      Mr. Speaker, last week the Minister of Finance (Mr. Selinger) said the individual who we have confidence in, the government appointee, the minis­ter's appointee to the board of directors, we will evaluate this appointment on the basis of the new board. The new board is now in. The minister will look at that but I would point out to the member opposite to make allegations of this individual's political, I think, is very unfair to that individual.

 

Crocus Fund

Government-Appointed Director

 

Mr. John Loewen (Fort Whyte): Mr. Speaker, the NDP government made a commitment to taxpayers to monitor the Crocus Fund and to look out for unit holders' and taxpayers' interests. Last week we saw another example of shareholder rights being trampled when the unit holders' last remaining elected director took the misguided step of appointing a director to represent the unit holders and then immediately resigning. This was a calculated move by those who control the fund to avoid allowing the unit holders to call a meeting to properly elect two directors to represent their interest.

      I would ask the Minister of Finance to explain to Manitobans how the NDP government could have sat on their hands while unit holders were deprived of their right to elect independent directors to look out for them.

 

Hon. Greg Selinger (Minister of Finance): The member seems to forget the history of how the fund was created by the government opposite. When the previous Minister of Finance announced that the fund was created, I am referring to Clayton Manness, he said he wanted a fund that was completely independent of government. He wanted the sponsor to have the control over how the board was governed. This independent body created by members opposite took their own actions. The member is saying he now wants us to interfere in that. That is the opposite to what they intended when they set it up.

 

Mr. Loewen: Mr. Speaker, this minister speaks with all the arrogance and serenity of somebody that has nothing invested in this fund and has nothing to lose. We understand perfectly why Mr. Curtis acted as he did. He is dependent on the fund to provide pay­ments to lawyers to represent him and to pay fines and judgments that may be levied against him in the future. He is compromised, he is beholden to the fund and this has obviously clouded his judgment.

 

      The question for the government to answer is this: What is clouding your judgment, sir? What is clouding your judgment? Why are you not doing everything possible to ensure that unit holders who have been left out in the cold have proper repre­sentation on the board? You should explain to Manitobans how it could be that they are left out in the cold once again.

 

Mr. Speaker: Order. I just wanted to let all members be aware that I have no judgment on any issues because, remember, all questions are put through the Chair not directly to a minister. So I ask the co-operation of all honourable members.

 

* (13:50)

 

Mr. Selinger: The unit holders have rights under The Crocus Investment Act, and in terms of litigation it was this government through this Minister of Justice (Mr. Mackintosh) which brought in class action lawsuit legislation which did not exist in this province before. They have the rights of class action lawsuits which never existed under the previous government.

 

      In addition, we gave the Auditor General new powers to investigate labour-sponsored funds with­out any limitations on his scope, without any limitations on the depth to which the Auditor can choose to go. We provided that right in legislation. We confirmed that right in writing. We now have in Manitoba more instruments to protect shareholders than ever existed under the previous government. We are allowing those instruments to work to their full extent.

 

Mr. Loewen: Once again the minister completely ignores the unit holders who have been fleeced of $60 million. They deserve proper representation on the board. The NDP government has an obligation to the unit holders and to the taxpayers to ensure that the board has an experienced, non-conflicted invest­ment professional sitting at the table when these decisions are made. Instead, the NDP government sits on its hands and pretends to know nothing while unit holders get fleeced and while board members continue to make decisions that will continue to see unit holders' money spent.

 

      Who is standing up for the unit holders? Will the minister guarantee today that he will replace Ron Waugh and that he will finally stand up for the unit holders? The board will not act in the best interests of the unit holders. In fact, they manipulate the process. Will the minister stand up today and for the sake of the unit holders ensure that a non-conflicted, experienced investment professional is appointed to the board immediately?

 

Mr. Selinger: The member opposite likes to take swings at everybody. I note that the new board members are people with strong reputations; a former provincial Auditor General, Carol Bellringer; a chartered accountant, Jim Husiak; a former partner in a public accounts firm, Van Hall, a person who is a chartered financial analyst with several years experience in Winnipeg's brokerage community.

 

      I say to the member opposite that the class action legislation which allows unit holders to pursue through the courts any rights or remedies they feel they are entitled to is considered the strongest legislation in Canada. The Auditor General's Act that we put in place after 20 years of neglect, 12 under members opposite, is among the strongest in Canada. We have not fettered any of those organizations to do their job. We have said once those reports come public we will act on them expeditiously.

 

Gang Activity

Reduction Strategy

 

Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Steinbach): Mr. Speaker, last weekend about the same time that the members of the NDP government were sending out travel material trying to encourage people to come to our province, local and national newspapers told a different story: "Stolen death car driven by gangster; 16-year-old gangster busted for shooting; Beating and abduction near Windsor Park; Police search for Hells Angels; U.S. Marine survives Iraq, stabbed by suspected gang member in The Pas."

 

      The reputation of our province is being held hostage by gang members. Will the Minister of Justice finally take the needed steps to ensure that Manitoba residents will be safe next weekend and this summer?

 

Hon. Gord Mackintosh (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): Mr. Speaker, over the last several days I also saw headlines that said: "Cops charge four in attack; Sex attack arrest, police charge suspect; Mounties get man, colleague busted; Trio charged in shooting, robbery; Hells pals nabbed, several held." I think that we should celebrate the hard work of our Winnipeg and RCMP police forces in making sure those who commit crimes in this province are held accountable and face justice.

 

Mr. Goertzen: Well, Mr. Speaker, we applaud the police getting these criminals off the street, but we wonder why the Minister of Justice keeps allowing them to go back on the street after they have been caught.

 

      Yesterday, at about the same time the annual tourist information was going out across Canada to try to get people to come to the province, Yves Lavigne, an international gang expert, was on the radio saying that violence needed to be reduced in the province, and that this week and this summer somebody innocent would die in the province because of the gang violence. At the same time, the NDP government is spending a half million dollars to try to spruce up the reputation of our province.

 

I wonder if the Minister of Justice could not just save that half million dollars and prove our reputation by making Manitoba gang-free. Why does he not put the money into getting these gangs off the street, Mr. Speaker?

 

* (13:55)

 

Mr. Mackintosh: I have only heard complaints from the member opposite and, indeed, I have only heard the vote nay. Mr. Speaker, opposing our commitment to public safety, the largest investment in recent memory in law enforcement, is not just about 54 new police officer positions over the next two years. It is about enhancing The Safer Communities and Neighbourhoods Act where there have been 92 drug dens and prostitution houses shut down.

 

      Mr. Speaker, it is also about investing in intelligence operations on organized crime by the creation now of a Corrections Organized Crime Intelligence Unit. It is also about though more hope and opportunities for youth with the addition of more Lighthouses. Those are initiatives the members opposite were opposed to.

 

Mr. Goertzen: Mr. Speaker, unfortunately, while the travel magazines talk about fishing season, the only catch-and-release happening today is in the justice system in Manitoba. In 1996, when there was a quarter of the known gang members that we have today, four years before the Hells Angels set up shop and eight years before the Premier (Mr. Doer) brought back the Bandidos from Texas, the now-Minister of Justice held a series of public forums to talk about gang issues. When there was only a quarter of the gang members that we have in Manitoba, the Member for St. John's (Mr. Mackintosh), the Member for Burrows (Mr. Martindale), the Member for Wellington (Mr. Santos), the Member for Elmwood (Mr. Maloway), the Member for Transcona (Mr. Reid) and the Member for Concordia, the Premier, held public forums to discuss cleaning up gang issues in the province.

 

With a 300% increase in gang members since this government has come into office, I wonder if the Minister of Justice can tell us what plans he has to have a public forum before the summer with police, community leaders and residents to clean up gangs in our streets.

 

Mr. Mackintosh: Mr. Speaker, I think one of the regrettable sagas of criminal justice history in Manitoba was that the members opposite continued to put their heads in the sand when they were in office and refused to acknowledge that there was organized crime in Manitoba and a serious increase in street gang activity from the early 1990s on.

 

That is regrettable and, of course, because they were in denial they could not take action. Oh, no, I retract that, Mr. Speaker. They did take action. I recall the gang hotline. It went unanswered in some little corner, some room somewhere for five months at a time. That is how serious they were when the Hells Angels came in, when the Zig Zag Crew came in, when the Warriors came in, when the Indian Posse came in, when the Deuce came in. Oh, but to them, there were no gangs and therefore no action. There has been nothing but action under this government.

 

Livestock Industry

U.S. Exports

 

Mr. Ralph Eichler (Lakeside): Mr. Speaker, lobby groups are on the hunt once again. Their intent is to stop boxed beef from crossing the border for 30 months and under, meat currently allowed into the United States. Will the Minister of Agriculture tell us how her government is planning on dealing with this issue should they be successful?

 

Hon. Rosann Wowchuk (Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Initiatives): I am sure everyone in this House is hopeful that group will not be suc­cessful in blocking boxed beef, Mr. Speaker, because the decision to open the border to boxed beef was made on science. There is absolutely no reason why we should not be continuing to send boxed beef into the United States and into Mexico.

 

However, we recognize that we have to increase slaughter capacity in this province. We are working with various groups who want to increase slaughter capacity. If you look at the numbers our slaughter capacity has increased. If you look at the numbers for 2002, we were slaughtering 16 500 animals. In 2004, we have slaughtered 28 000 animals and we will continue to increase that number.

 

Livestock Industry

Slaughter Capacity

 

Mr. Ralph Eichler (Lakeside): Mr. Speaker, while packing plants in the U.S. are closing and layoffs are happening on a daily basis this government continues to say open the border, we have the cattle. While we agree we would like to see the border reopened to all our beef, members on this side of the House know we need a long-term solution for our ranchers. We need our own processing plants here in Manitoba.

 

      Mr. Speaker, when will the minister do the right thing and increase meaningful slaughter capacity and open plants in the province of Manitoba and bring jobs to the province of Manitoba?

 

Hon. Rosann Wowchuk (Minister of Agriculture, Food and Rural Initiatives): Mr. Speaker, the member opposite talks about wanting to open the border. Indeed, we want to open the border. The U.S. Secretary of Agriculture has said that he wants to open the border. We will continue to work with our industry to ensure that slaughter capacity increases. I will repeat for the member. In 2002, we were slaugh­tering 16 500 animals; in 2004, we are at 28 000 animals. We are going to continue to increase. Every year it will continue to increase and we will work with those people.

 

      Mr. Speaker, we will continue to work with those people who want to increase slaughter capacity in this province. I would hope the members opposite would also recognize the importance of increasing slaughter capacity and be there to support the producers rather than be critical of those people who are increasing slaughter capacity.

 

* (14:00)

 

Mr. Eichler: Mr. Speaker, we are not critical of our producers or those people wanting to invest in the province. We are critical of this minister. That is the key and if she is proud of growing from 16 000 and 30 000, then she needs to listen to these numbers.

 

      Mr. Speaker, outside of Edmonton last week, a processing plant killing 500 per day, do your math, Madam Minister, was announced. Tyson Foods announced an extra 900 per day on top of their 3700; Cargill with their expansion; Saskatchewan's new and remodelled plants; Ontario with new and remod­elled plants; Manitoba, nothing but announcements.

 

      Mr. Speaker, does this minister realize, while the NDP government does nothing, other provinces are stealing our beef processing business and our jobs that belong right here in Manitoba?

Ms. Wowchuk: If the member wants to look at other provinces perhaps he should look at the history of this province and what happened while they were in government and who left this province. If the members opposite were really interested in slaughter capacity in this province when they were in government they would have saved the Burns plant, they would have saved other plants. Our producers had to find new markets because that slaughter capacity was lost. They found new markets.

 

      People in Manitoba are now interested in increasing slaughter capacity, and I would encourage members opposite that rather than being critical of those people in this province who have in some cases doubled their slaughter capacity, they should be there to encourage them and support them, rather than criticize them for what they had–[interjection] I believe that going from the number of 16 500 to 28 000 is a significant increase.

 

Point of Order

 

Mr. Speaker: The honourable Member for Emerson, on a point of order?

 

Mr. Jack Penner (Emerson): Mr. Speaker, on a point of order. The minister should check her own records: Better than 500 000 cattle slaughtered in the province of Manitoba when they took office under the Pawley administration. There was 120 000–

 

Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.

 

Mr. Speaker: Order. On the point of order raised by the honourable Member for Emerson, there is no point of order.

 

      I would like to remind all honourable members that when rising on a point of order it is to point out to the Speaker a breach of a rule or a departure of procedure of the House. We still have lots of time in Question Period remaining. Please do not use points of orders for matters of debate.

 

Pediatric Dental Surgery

Waiting Lists

 

Mrs. Heather Stefanson (Tuxedo):  Mr. Speaker, children continue to wait in pain for dental surgery in our province. Eight months ago the Maples Surgical Centre submitted a proposal to this government which would deplete the wait list for pediatric dental surgery in the province within one year. Yet, because the minister is so blinded by his ideology, he refused to even consider the proposal. We have now learned since the Minister of Health's announcement on December 1, 2004, only 50 of the 600 promised pro­cedures have been completed at Misericordia Hospital.

 

      Will the Minister of Health admit that he irresponsibly provided false hope to these children by promising to complete these surgeries?

 

Hon. Tim Sale (Minister of Health): Mr. Speaker, as I made plain last week, I am disappointed in the progress that we made on our commitment that we will fulfil. I have received assurances from WRHA that this goal of 600 by the end of December will, in fact, be achieved. They have put steps in place to ensure that takes place.

 

      Mr. Speaker, as for the offer of Maples, the problem in the system is anesthesiologists. It is not operating rooms, it is not equipment, it is not dentists. It is anesthesiologists, and Maples cannot manufacture them any more than anybody else can.

 

Maples Surgical Centre

Pediatric Dental Surgery

 

Mrs. Heather Stefanson (Tuxedo): The Maples centre has already said they would bring in the anesthetists to be able to fulfil their contract, Mr. Speaker. This is irresponsible for this government to not consider their proposal.

 

      Under this minister's watch only 50 of the 600 promised surgeries have been completed at Misericordia to date. This minister was warned in March when he was informed that only two surgeries had been completed. He has again been warned today that only 50 surgeries have been completed, yet he claims to be shocked and says he did not know the WRHA would not be able to follow through with his promises. If this minister had only set aside his ideology and contracted with the Maples Surgical Centre to perform these procedures eight months ago, 380 of these surgeries would have been completed to date.

 

      Will the Minister of Health now admit he made a mistake and agree to partner with the Maples Surgical Centre to ensure that the 600 surgeries he promised Manitoba children will, in fact, take place?

Hon. Tim Sale (Minister of Health): Mr. Speaker, I will never admit that it is a mistake to support the publicly funded, publicly accountable, publicly administered medicare system in our country. I will never accept it is a mistake to support that system.

 

      Furthermore, Mr. Speaker, what Maples offered was that they would bring in anesthesiologists from somewhere else, I do not know where, and we would pay for it. Not Maples, not within Maples pro­cedures, we would pay for them as extra. We pay the anesthetists. We will continue to pay the anesthetists as we always have. Their bringing in more and charging on top of the rate they propose to us is not a solution.

 

Mrs. Stefanson: What the Minister of Health is essentially saying, and I am glad he finally put it on the record today, is that he would support his ideology over what is in the best interests of patients in this province and our children, Mr. Speaker. Shame on him.

 

      Will the Minister of Health now agree to consider partnering with the Maples Surgical Centre to ensure that 600 pediatric dental surgeries he promised are actually completed this year, Mr. Speaker? He has a choice.

 

Mr. Sale: Mr. Speaker, in regard to ideology, I would like to tell the member about Dr. Alan Maynard who was brought in by Ralph Klein to their symposium in Alberta which was supposed to triumph the privatization of health care. What Dr. Alan Maynard said was that the U.S. experience and the U.K. experience show that the investor-owned component for health care is more expensive, provides less service per dollar and, in brackets, he said that it kills more people. Now I do not necessarily agree with the latter point, but the experts that came from France, Germany, the United Kingdom all said, "Do not privatize. It does not save money. It does not reduce waiting lists." Mr. Klein thought the opposite would be the case. His own symposium proved him wrong.

 

Post-Secondary Education

Funding

 

Mrs. Leanne Rowat (Minnedosa): Mr. Speaker, this NDP government continues to underfund our post-secondary institutions during times of unpre­cedented revenues. This fall it appears that students will have to deal with drastic fee increases when they go back to school. These are backdoor taxes.

 

      Mr. Speaker, why does the Minister of Advanced Education continue to ignore the plight of our post-secondary institutions? When will she finally provide stable and predictable funding that will ensure the quality of programming is not compromised?

 

Hon. Diane McGifford (Minister of Advanced Education and Training): I was pleased last week to provide the member with a detailed list of some of the things that we have done for students. I would be happy to provide her a hard copy or to repeat that list for her.

 

      Certainly this government is committed to affordable and accessible education. We see edu­cation as an investment in young people in our communities and in our province. We are on the side of young people. We have been unwavering in our support for young people attending post-secondary education.

 

      We are the ones, Mr. Speaker, who introduced what is nearly now a $7-million government bursary. They are the ones who, in 1992-93, in the heat of July, in the dead of the night, cancelled the Manitoba Bursary making the only option available to students in this province student loans.

 

Mrs. Rowat: Mr. Speaker, a quick glance at our neighbouring western provinces shows how large the funding discrepancies in Manitoba post-secondary institutions has become. Saskatchewan, which right now does have a tuition freeze, has granted a 6.8% increase in operational grants compared to just over 2 percent for the University of Manitoba. Saskatche­wan recognizes that if you impose a tuition freeze you must provide substantial operating grant funding.

 

      Mr. Speaker, when will this Minister of Advanced Education recognize what Saskatchewan has realized and acted upon?

 

* (14:10)

 

Ms. McGifford: I would like to inform the member of information she should already have and that is, Mr. Speaker, since 1999 we have increased grants to post-secondary education by $45 million.  The best news is yet to come. When we include the municipal property tax relief, something which the members opposite were against, that number is $57 million.

 

      Mr. Speaker, I could also refer the member to Stats Canada which says that we have the second highest funding per student in the country. So I think that Saskatchewan may have something to learn from us.

 

Mrs. Rowat: Mr. Speaker, I am sure they are watching with bated breath as the University of Manitoba increases their ancillary fees by 12.5 percent and Brandon University by 15 percent.

 

      Mr. Speaker, elsewhere in western Canada universities are receiving between 5.5% to 8.1% increases in operational grants while this NDP government is continuing to short-change our universities.

 

      Mr. Speaker, when will the universities and students of this province expect from this Minister of Advanced Education the kind of stable and predictable funding that will finally put an end to these skyrocketing ancillary fees that solely maintain current services rather than enhancing them?

 

Ms. McGifford: Well, Mr. Speaker, we have provided stable funding to our universities and colleges. We have provided operational increases every year. We also have provided $100 million in capital.

 

      I find it, well, I suppose I could say passing strange that a government that provided increases which the Minister of Education, Citizenship and Youth (Mr. Bjornson) has pointed out are kind of like a spring weather forecast, minus 2, zero, minus 2, minus zero, has the audacity to come into this Legislature and talk to us about university and college funding. Our record with universities and colleges, our record with post-secondary education is exemplary.

 

Child Poverty Rate

Reduction Strategy

 

Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Speaker, poverty is a major contributor to poor health and a significant contributor to crime, yet the latest data which I table shows that Manitoba's child poverty rate has increased under the NDP and 22 percent of children in Manitoba now live in poverty. This compares to only 11 percent in Prince Edward Island and 16 percent in Ontario. This is not the only index getting worse. The number of workers employed at minimum wage jobs in Manitoba has increased over the last several years.

 

      My question to the Premier (Mr. Doer) is does the government have a target number which it aims to reduce the child poverty rate by the end of this mandate. What is the Premier's target? When, after five and a half years on the job, will the Premier table his attack, his plan to reduce child poverty?

 

Hon. Nancy Allan (Acting Minister of Family Services and Housing): Mr. Speaker, I am glad the Leader of the Liberal Party mentioned minimum wage in his question because since we got into gov­ernment, since 1999, we have raised the minimum wage five times and we have raised it approximately 20 percent.

 

      In our recent budget, Mr. Speaker, we also increased northern food allowance rates making healthy food in the North more affordable. I just want to remind the member opposite that is a budget he voted against.

 

Mr. Gerrard: Mr. Speaker, just a few minutes ago the Justice Minister accused the Tories of having their heads in the sand. Well, when it comes to child poverty, it is very clear that the NDP government have their heads in the sand.

 

      Mr. Speaker, in spite of the rants and raves of the Minister of Labour and her attempts to blame everybody else, the reality is there are still far too many Manitoba children living in poverty and this is contributing to the extraordinarily high health care and justice costs under this government. Either the Premier is pursuing a conservative status quo, preserve the high poverty rate, or he has no target and no plan to reduce poverty, or he has a secret plan which has either not been implemented or he just does not care. Which is it? Which is it? Which is it?

 

Ms. Allan: Mr. Speaker, two very important public policy areas that assist people living in poverty are child care and also housing. We have improved access to child care allowing more parents to go to work and to go to school. We have funded 3500 spaces and increased subsidies to parents. Spending on child care has increased 64 percent since our government took office in 1999.

 

      We have also committed more than $25 million over five years to increase the supply of safe, affordable housing in Manitoba through the Affordable Housing Initiative, a partnership with the federal government; $8 million has been committed over four years for the Winnipeg Housing and Homelessness Initiative. We have also eliminated the National Child Benefit clawback putting $13.7 million into the hands of low-income families in Manitoba.

 

Cellular Telephones

Restrictions for use while Driving

 

Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Mr. Speaker, all of us are very much aware that cellular telephones in their popularity have grown phenomenally across North America. Out of that growth, what we have seen is a great deal of concern in regard to vehicle traffic, in particular drivers. The issue of safety has been raised time and time again. I think Manitobans want to see a government that is going to be progressive in the sense of bringing forward ideas, that it is going to have a tangible impact on the issue of safety with regard to cellular telephones?

 

      My question to the government is what plans does it have to ensure that the safety of Manitobans is going to be taken into consideration in dealing with driving, while at the same time talking on cellular telephones?

 

Hon. Ron Lemieux (Minister of Transportation and Government Services): Mr. Speaker, we have done and taken a lot of action with regard to safety on the roads, not only the twinning of highways around the province but graduated driver's licence which we brought in a few years ago.

 

      Specifically, to this particular question on cell phones, right now there are a number of different studies taking place and have taken place with regard to this issue. Newfoundland is one province that has looked at it. The jury is out with regard to taking a look at the benefits to what they initiated in cell phones. We, as a government, are talking to other governments and looking at the issue in a very serious manner.

 

Churchill River Diversion

Archeological Program

 

Mr. Gerard Jennissen (Flin Flon): Mr. Speaker, preserving historical sights and artifacts is important to all Manitobans, but it is especially critical and vital for Aboriginal people who have lived on this land for thousands of years. Could the Minister of Culture, Heritage and Tourism update this House on the Churchill River diversion archeological program?

 

Mr. Robinson: Mr. Speaker, I had the pleasure on Manitoba Day to work with the communities of Nelson House, South Indian Lake and Split Lake in signing a memorandum of understanding that is really to preserve the integrity of historic resources in the communities affected by the Churchill River diversion. I was happy to host Chief Jerry Primrose of Nisichawayasihk Cree Nation, headman Chris Baker of the South Indian Lake community and Victor Spence representing the Tataskweyak Cree Nation.

 

      The commitment our government has made, Mr. Speaker, is to work together with these communities to protect and recover heritage that otherwise might be lost. Further, it is a vision among the Cree people that we should recover, preserve and pass on to the next generations in a way that is meaningful to the Cree peoples who are the caretakers of the heritage within their lands. I want to thank the Minister responsible for Hydro (Mr. Chomiak) for joining me in hosting these communities.

 

Child Poverty Rate

Reduction Strategy

 

Mrs. Mavis Taillieu (Morris): Mr. Speaker, this government is failing to reduce the child poverty rate. Even though the Minister of Labour stands in her place and boasts of all the programs she says she has enacted, they are simply falling short, they are not working. There are no improvements for families in Manitoba. This government simply must do better. It is failing thousands of Manitoba families and children.

 

      Can the Minister of Family Services (Ms. Melnick) put aside her political rhetoric and simply advise this House what her plan is to reduce child poverty in our province?

 

* (14:20)

 

Hon. Nancy Allan (Acting Minister of Family Services and Housing): Well, I would like to thank the member for the question. I just want to comment that child poverty we take very, very seriously, Mr. Speaker, and that is why we have enacted public policy initiatives in many departments across this government.

 

      I would also like to talk about the Healthy Baby program that provides parent education programs for mothers-to-be in 65 Manitoba neighbourhoods and communities. It is a nutrition income supplement that benefited over 4000 low-income women in the years 2003 and 2004. We take poverty very seriously, Mr. Speaker, and we will continue to work on this in a very serious way.

 

Mr. Speaker: Time for Oral Questions has expired.

 

MEMBERS' STATEMENTS

 

ESL Programs

 

Ms. Kerri Irvin-Ross (Fort Garry): Mr. Speaker, I rise today to congratulate a number of special women who have successfully completed their ESL, English as a second language training. As the MLA for Fort Garry, I had the pleasure of sending my greetings to last week's graduating class who completed their training at Fort Garry Mennonite Brethren.

 

      Mr. Speaker, learning a new language is challenging. These women, most of whom are new immigrants, have proved that it can be done. Last week's graduates completed a course for women who are transitioning into new occupations or schooling, while today's graduates have completed courses that provide a solid grounding in English.

     

      Both programs are unique since they are community-based and support their students by providing child care and the opportunity to meet other women, to build friendships and support networks. Many graduates will be further pursuing ESL training, employment or schooling in their interest areas.

 

      The Department of Labour and Immigration is committed to providing essential services like ESL training to new Manitobans. Our government believes that practical programs like ESL training are integral in helping new residents successfully con­tribute to our communities.

 

      I especially want to thank the parishioners of Fort Garry Mennonite Brethren for supporting this group of graduates. Mr. Speaker, I congratulate all graduates who have completed their ESL training. I especially want to thank Linda Xie and Bernadette McCann, the community co-ordinators for these programs. I wish all graduates continued success in the future, and thank all community groups for supporting local ESL programs. Thank you.

 

Dugald United Church

 

Mr. Ron Schuler (Springfield): On Sunday, May 15, 2005, I attended the 115th anniversary of the Dugald United Church. Here is the text from the cairn that was unveiled and stands in front of the church building: Settlement of the area in and around Dugald became general in the early 1870s. Transportation at that time was by foot or by horse on mud roads as the railroad, now the CNR, was not completed until 1907. Thus Dugald village, then known as North Plympton, began to develop as a service centre. Church was very important to those early settlers. Protestant services were first held in homes, conducted alternately between Presbyterians and Methodists.

 

      In 1887 the Presbyterians began planning a church building. A violent windstorm during construction blew down the walls and did con­siderable damage. The completed church was dedicated in 1889. Records show the Methodists arranged to also use the new church for their services. A basement and a large vestibule were added to the church in 1914, but water seepage into the basement was a constant problem. In 1922 the church was supplied with electric lighting from Gillespie's generating plant, but fluctuating power burned out so many bulbs they returned to gas lighting. Hydro-electricity finally came to the area in 1946.

 

      In 1954 a new basement was constructed and a room added to the east end of the church. The following year saw many improvements to the building, both inside and out. The building as it now stands is being maintained in large part by donations which have been made to a memorial fund established in 1977.

 

      In 1908 the Methodists constructed a church on the site where the curling now stands. Services alternated morning and evening between the two churches. In 1923, the Methodists decided to close their church and join with the Dugald Presbyterians. Their church building was moved to south Transcona. When union between Methodists and Presbyterians was official in 1925, Dugald was already a United Church.

 

      In 1897 the Presbyterians of South Plympton  planned and built a church on what is now PR 206, three and a quarter miles south of Dugald. This church thrived until a decline in rural population made it impractical to continue services. The remain­ing congregation joined the Dugald congregation–

 

Mr. Speaker: Order. Does the honourable member have leave? [Agreed]

 

Mr. Schuler:–and their building was dismantled in 1972.

 

      Since ministry or clergy appointments were generally not long term and transportation was slow and unreliable, churches in the rural areas required a residence for clergy, known as a manse or parsonage. The home across the street from the church was built in 1893 and served as the United Church manse until 1962 when a new manse was built east of the church. It was no longer required in 1993 and was sold.

 

      The cairn was erected in May 2005 in recognition of the pioneers of the Dugald district, and the 80th anniversary of the United Church of Canada. Thank you.

 

ANCOP International

 

Mr. Cris Aglugub (The Maples):  I rise today to highlight a very important event I will be attending on Saturday, May 21, at the Manitoba Centennial Concert Hall. This event is in support of ANCOP International Canada Incorporated.

 

      Mr. Speaker, ANCOP International is a non-profit organization that aims to achieve global harmony. ANCOP International attempts to alleviate poverty in many communities worldwide by working with local residents to create thriving neigh­bourhoods. Volunteers help build new and affordable houses, new schools and recreation centres, water systems and playgrounds. ANCOP volunteers also help to establish health clinics and education pro­grams for young kids in their communities.

 

      Mr. Speaker, the ANCOP event in Winnipeg will help to raise funds for the work done by Gawad Kalinga, a humanitarian group established in the Philippines. In Filipino, gawad kalinga means, quote, "to give care." This organization aims at improving the cultural, social, educational and health levels of Filipino residents and communities. All proceeds from this event will go towards building a new village in the Philippines. The village will provide safe and affordable housing, medical, educational and recreational facilities for residents.

 

      Mr. Speaker, I am very happy to be attending this event. I want to thank Lanny Zacarias, ANCOP Manitoba area director, for co-ordinating this event. I also want to thank Ed Villamar, Vic Lopez and all the other volunteers with ANCOP for their hard work and dedication. I urge my fellow House col­leagues to support the humanitarian work of groups like ANCOP. As Canadians we have a responsibility to support and help our neighbours around the world. Thank you.

 

* (14:30)

 

Commonwealth Air Training Plan Museum

 

Mrs. Leanne Rowat (Minnedosa): With this year being designated as the Year of the Veteran, I feel it is fitting to recognize Manitoba's efforts during World War II in the British Commonwealth Air Training Plan. Commonly known as the Plan, this massive air training program was responsible for training air crew from Canada, Australia, Britain and New Zealand. Under the Plan, 131 553 pilots, navigators, wireless air gunners, air gunners, flight engineers and bomb aimers received their training during the four and a half years of operation. By 1945, the Royal Canadian Air Force had become the world's fourth largest air force.