LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF
Friday, April 22, 1994
The House met at 10 a.m.
PRAYERS
ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS
Curran Contract Cancellation and
Pharmacare and Home Care Reinstatement
Mr. Speaker:
I have reviewed the petition of the honourable member (Ms.
Barrett). It complies with the
privileges and the practices of the House and complies with the rules. Is it the will of the House to have the
petition read?
An Honourable Member:
Yes.
Mr. Speaker:
The Clerk will read.
Mr. Clerk (William Remnant):
The petition of the undersigned citizens of the
WHEREAS
the Manitoba government has repeatedly broken promises to support the
Pharmacare program and has in fact cut benefits and increased deductibles far
above the inflation rate; and
WHEREAS
the Pharmacare program was brought in by the NDP as a preventative program
which keeps people out of costly hospital beds and institutions; and
WHEREAS
rather than cutting benefits and increasing deductibles the provincial
government should be demanding the federal government cancel recent cuts to
generic drugs that occurred under the Drug Patent Act; and
WHEREAS
at the same time
WHEREAS
the
WHEREFORE
your petitioners humbly pray that the Legislative Assembly urge the Premier to
personally step in and order the cancellation of the Connie Curran contract and
consider cancelling the recent cuts to the Pharmacare and Home Care programs.
Mr. Speaker:
I have reviewed the petition of the honourable member (Mr.
Martindale). It complies with the
privileges and the practices of the House and complies with the rules. Is it the will of the House to have the
petition read?
Some Honourable Members:
Dispense.
Mr. Speaker:
Dispense.
The petition of the undersigned
citizens of the
WHEREAS the Manitoba government has
repeatedly broken promises to support the Pharmacare program and has in fact
cut benefits and increased deductibles far above the inflation rate; and
WHEREAS the Pharmacare program was
brought in by the NDP as a preventative program which keeps people out of
costly hospital beds and institutions; and
WHEREAS rather than cutting benefits
and increasing deductibles the provincial government should be demanding the
federal government cancel recent cuts to generic drugs that occurred under the
Drug Patent Act; and
WHEREAS at the same time
WHEREAS the
WHEREFORE your petitioners humbly
pray that the Legislative Assembly urge the Premier to personally step in and
order the cancellation of the Connie Curran contract; and consider cancelling
the recent cuts to the Pharmacare and Home Care programs.
Introduction of Guests
Mr. Speaker:
Prior to Oral Questions, may I direct the attention of honourable
members to the gallery to my left where we have with us this morning Mr. Parker
Burrell, the former MLA for
On
behalf of all honourable members, I would like to welcome you here this
morning, sir.
Also
with us this morning we have, from the
On
behalf of all honourable members, I would like to welcome you here this
morning.
ORAL QUESTION PERIOD
Victims' Assistance Program
Funding Reduction
Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the
Opposition): Mr. Speaker, there has been a considerable
discrepancy between the words of this government dealing with justice issues
and the actions of this government.
The
Victims' Assistance program is a program that symbolizes, in a very small way,
our commitment to those people that are unfortunately victims of crimes. Many people in our society are saying there
is too little balance between those who are committing the crimes and between
those who are victims of the crimes.
I
would like to ask this government why they have cut the Victims' Assistance
program in this year's budget and why they have demonstrated this cut at a time
when people are crying out for support for victims in our
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister of
Justice and Attorney General): Mr. Speaker, this
government is paying a great deal of attention to the concerns of victims. Certainly in our initiatives in relating to youth
crime and also domestic violence, we are looking very strongly to support the
concerns of victims.
The
Victims' Assistance funding and programs within this budget does fund four
programs. I am not sure if the member is
aware of the four programs. We fund a
women's advocacy program. We fund the
child witness support program, the Criminal Injuries Compensation program, the
Victim Witness Assistance program, and we also have a fund in which we provide
grants for the community.
We
continue our commitment, and in fact my department continues to take a more and
more active role in terms of the support of victims within this province.
Mr. Doer:
Mr. Speaker, of course, we know that crime prevention programs were cut
by $100,000 a couple of years ago by this government. We know that Victims' Assistance programs are
down again under all the categories.
* (1005)
Department of Justice
Corrections Initiatives
Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the
Opposition): I have a further question to the Minister of
Justice.
Since
1989, violent youth crime has increased by 58 percent. The youth corrections funding has gone down
in 1993 by 4.3 percent, and Corrections overall is about zero percent increase. We have a major increase in people committing
the crimes but yet no increase in commitment from this government to deal with
those people that are accused of crimes that are disposed of committing those
crimes.
I
would like to know why this government is saying one thing about getting tough
on crime and doing something else in terms of the resources they are putting
in. Could they not have taken some of
the tax breaks they had for business and put those into a real effective fight
on dealing with youth crime in our society?
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister of
Justice and Attorney General): Mr. Speaker, I am
very pleased to have the opportunity to speak about our efforts in Corrections
and our efforts to fight crime in this province.
Let
me start with the issues around youth crime, the nine‑point plan that
this government released to deal with youth crime and violence. That nine‑point plan deals with the
prevention end. It also deals with
community support, youth justice committees.
It also deals with Corrections.
It deals with initiatives in relation to the federal government. It deals with councils of experts to be
available to assist the citizens of
In
the area of Corrections, the area of administration, as all areas of government
have, we have looked at reductions in the area of administration. I will remind the member that we have major
initiatives in the area of Corrections, particularly in the youth area, where
we are moving towards the wilderness camp model and a more rigorous confinement
of all people within our institutions in
Mr. Doer:
Mr. Speaker, I would invite the Premier to read the nine‑point
plan and look at the budget and see where the appropriate funding is in terms
of antiviolence programs in schools. Many
of the other programs in the plan are not reflected in the budget.
Provincial Courts
Backlogs
Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the
Opposition): One of the areas that is not reflected in the
budget is, of course, the whole issue of the backlog in the courts. Justice delayed is justice denied. We have cited, and our Justice critic has
cited, on a number of occasions the backlogs of 11 and 12 months. We are hearing of cases being disposed of up
to two years after the initial allegations are made in our youth courts. For young people, immediate consequences are
fairly significant as a factor in our justice system.
The
court services have been reduced by this government, creating the backlog by
3.4 percent in '93 and '94, and this year they have increased funding .8
percent, less than 1 percent. We will
not even be funding our court services equal to two years ago.
I
would ask the government how this inadequate funding and inadequate priority
are going to deal with the backlog in our court system and start getting us
more immediate justice in our communities.
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister of
Justice and Attorney General): I am very happy to
speak about our court system also because the member has continually quoted
dates and periods of time which are inaccurate.
I can say to the member that the courts across this province are
functioning very well, that the one court in which we are looking at ways to
deal with the backlog is the
I
would remind that member that it was this government that showed the commitment
to the victims of domestic violence and to the issues of domestic violence in
the setting up of that court.
We
now have named a new chief provincial court judge, and I am working very
closely with the new chief judge to look at the operations of the courts. We are looking continually at ways to make
the whole system the most efficient system that it can be.
* (1010)
Bill 22
Health Care System
Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan):
My question is for the Premier.
The
Premier stated publicly, Mr. Speaker, and I quote: The effects of Bill 22 only apply to the
administration, and we are not talking about patient care people.
It
is clear that the overall hammer effect of the government's imposition of Bill
22 will see a reduction in some patient services and probably personnel.
My
question to the Premier is: Why has the
government ordered Bill 22 be imposed at health care institutions and nursing
homes who have already seen their budgets reduced by over $58 million in the last
two years alone?
Hon. Gary Filmon (Premier):
As we have indicated, the intention is to try and ensure that we apply
Bill 22 equally across the province. The
nurses' union voluntarily took a minus 2 percent in their contractual
settlement. The intent is to have the
same kind of application available to other personnel working within all of our
areas of government, and so they apply in Crown corporations. So they apply to agencies that receive their
funding from government, and it is the equal application, Mr. Speaker.
It
need not reduce services as long as people are prepared to ensure that they
live within the means that are available to them and that all personnel take
that kind of approach that the nurses took and share the burden of living within
the available dollars that we have.
That, to us, was the preferable approach.
Mr. Chomiak:
Mr. Speaker, I think the patients of
My
supplementary to the Premier, Mr. Speaker, is:
Why is the government forcing places like
Mr. Filmon:
Mr. Speaker, the way in which New Democratic administrations are sharing
this burden is to close 52 hospitals in rural Saskatchewan, to close hundreds
of beds as well as a major urban hospital in Vancouver‑‑that is how
British Columbia is sharing it‑‑to close 3,500 beds in
Ontario. That is how NDP Ontario is
sharing the burden. We think it is
preferable to have the staff work co‑operatively with the government to
maintain the services by accepting a reduction in their own pay packets as part
of the process of trying to maintain the quality health care system that we
have in
Mr. Chomiak:
Mr. Speaker, my final supplementary to the Premier.
I
will table copies of a letter from a hospital administrator which says, and I
quote: " . . . implementation of
Bill 22 will mean we have no option but to replace almost 100% of the staff
affected. We are unable to impose Bill
22 in a cost effective manner without compromising on standards and quality of
care."
How
can the Premier talk about patients after they have cut $58 million from health
care facilities and personal care homes and say we are not compromising? This is unfair, Mr. Speaker. How does the Premier justify it?
Mr. Filmon:
Mr. Speaker, since we have been in office, this government has increased
funding in six years to health care by a half billion dollars, a half billion
dollars. This government has increased
not only total dollars on health care to a much higher level than they were
when we took office, but as a proportion of our budget at 33.9 percent, it is
the highest that it has ever been in the history of this province. This government has made its commitment.
If
the workers would do as the nurses did and accept a voluntary rollback, maybe
some of these measures would not be required.
That is the way in which these things can be shared and can be done in
an effective manner.
* (1015)
Home Repair Industry
Standards/Regulations
Mr. Paul Edwards (Leader of the
Second Opposition): Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister
of Consumer and Corporate Affairs.
This
government has committed $10 million under the Home Renovation Program
announced in the budget two days ago.
That $10 million at a thousand dollars grant per renovation equates to
approximately 10,000 additional home renovation contracts that will be signed
in this coming year, the government predicts.
The Minister of Consumer and Corporate Affairs, I believe, has from time
to time recognized and acknowledged that there are in fact no regulations in
the home renovation industry, that in fact it is a wide‑open industry,
there are not standards in place, and that in fact the home renovation industry
themselves have repeatedly asked for those standards and some form of
regulatory regime.
Mr.
Speaker, my question for the minister:
Currently on the Order Paper at No. 32 is a resolution from our caucus
calling for those standards to be put in place.
Will the minister today bring that forward so that we can ensure that
the consumers are protected from unscrupulous home renovators and also
recognize that that is in fact what the industry has been asking for, for some
time?
Hon. Jim Ernst (Minister of Consumer
and Corporate Affairs): I can advise firstly to my
honourable friend that there is a requirement, I believe, under this program to
have at least two quotes, two separate bids, from contractors so that there is
one to make a comparison with the other.
Secondly,
there are laws in The Business Practices Act, The Consumer Protection Act
contained in this province which will and can deal with unscrupulous operators.
The
member also is aware in terms of bringing his resolution forward that we are
for the next seven days involved in budget speech debate, and the rules of the
House do not permit that to come forward.
Mr.
Speaker, I understand the member's concern.
We have the Consumers' Bureau. We
will be on the lookout for unscrupulous activities amongst those few
contractors who might choose to do that kind of activity, but I think, by and
large, that there will be enough protection built into the program itself that
we should not have a major problem with respect to contractors who do not wish
to follow the rules.
Mr. Edwards:
The minister mentions the current legislative regime. That legislative regime can only protect
consumers if in fact there are standards, if there is some form of regulatory
regime in place for this particular industry.
My
question again for the minister: Is this
government actively considering in fact putting those into place in this
session?‑‑because that is important as thousands of people, they
hope, will take advantage of this program.
Is this government going to come forward with some form of regulatory
regime for the home renovation industry, which I remind the minister the
industry itself has repeatedly asked for?
Mr. Ernst:
Mr. Speaker, 99 percent of the problem in this area has occurred in the
past by door‑to‑door salespeople coming to the door and trying to
convince people, particularly those who perhaps are not well acquainted with
how these matters work.
Mr.
Speaker, we have licensing of door‑to‑door salespeople. They are bonded, and they are monitored very
closely to ensure that those kinds of unscrupulous activities are kept to a
minimum.
Mr.
Speaker, The Business Practices Act also deals with people who are unscrupulous
in their activities. The fact of the
matter is that by having programs with requirements for two quotations from
contractors submitted to the people who are going to be having the work done
and then filing that with the department as it is dealt with, should
reasonably, adequately protect the people.
As
well, of course, there is an association of renovation contractors who do follow
a code of ethics and practice. People
would be well advised to seek out those contractors who belong to that
association or other reputable contractors and to check that out before they
accept any offers, before they have work completed.
* (1020)
Consumer Education Program
Mr. Paul Edwards (Leader of the
Second Opposition): The minister appears to be relying on the two‑quotation
system. That is going to be small
comfort for the many individuals out there who have in the past been taken
advantage of. When the RRAP program was
in place in prior years, this was a serious problem which in fact Consumer and
Corporate Affairs advocates recognized, the Consumers' Association and others
recognized; indeed, the association recognized it itself.
Mr.
Speaker, my final question for the minister:
Given that apparently his answers would indicate that there is not going
to be some form of regulatory regime coming into place, will the minister at
least agree to embark on an educational campaign to educate consumers about
what they should do, the questions they should ask and the type of
investigation that they should do as they move to enter into this period where
we are going to see a massive increase in activity in this area?
They
have money for promotional campaigns, for their own political purposes. Will they now educate the public about what
needs to be done to ensure that these are reputable people getting business at
fair prices?
Hon. Jim Ernst (Minister of Consumer
and Corporate Affairs): Mr. Speaker, the Consumers'
Bureau today has all kinds of literature related to ensuring that people
understand what is going on, the kind of practice that they should follow to
ensure that they have fair and reasonable work done by others on their behalf. That information is available to people. We can provide it to the appropriate
departments, either Housing or Finance, if people are interested in having that
information. The Seniors bureau has a
videotape and contained within that videotape, which is widely spread, deals
with issues like home renovation contractors and what people should look for
and how they should conduct themselves when dealing with those kinds of people.
Port of Churchill
CN Rail Commitment
Ms. Rosann Wowchuk (Swan River):
Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Acting Minister of Highways and
Transportation.
Canadian
farmers continue to face financial problems because the Canadian grain
transportation system cannot meet its commitments to ship grain, yet each year
in Manitoba the Port of Churchill remains underutilized. Last week the Minister of Transportation said
he would meet with CN Rail to ask that they maximize the Port of Churchill
shipping line and ship grain to Churchill.
Can
the minister tell us today if CN is committed to fully utilizing the Hudson Bay
line and to ship the maximum amount of grain through the Port of Churchill this
summer?
Hon. Albert Driedger (Acting
Minister of Highways and Transportation): Mr. Speaker,
most of the question I will take as notice on behalf of the Minister of
Highways and Transportation, but I want to say that if the member had listened
very carefully to the budget speech that was made the other day, there was a
further commitment for assistance for the rail lines to make them more
competitive. I think this is a good
indication of the position that we provincially take in terms of our concern
for the rail industry in Manitoba as well as Churchill.
Ms. Wowchuk:
Mr. Speaker, since the NDP along with many organizations has asked CN to
use hopper cars and move grain on the bayline for many years, and since there
are tanker fuel cars going to the Port of Churchill at the present time and
since Keystone Agricultural Producers have passed a resolution calling for the
testing of hopper cars on the bayline, what steps will the minister take to
ensure that CN will start using hopper cars to haul grain to the Port of
Churchill?
Mr. Driedger:
Mr. Speaker, I feel as if I have not even left the Department of
Highways and Transportation, because for five and a half years, this is the
regular debate that took place in terms of what the government is doing.
The
member should be well aware of all the players that are involved in this thing,
the first one being the Wheat Board basically that sells the grain. If you are not going to have customers to
take grain through the Port of Churchill, then there is no sense shipping
anything through there. But I have to
tell you there are other players involved as well, not just CN.
If
the member wants to take some time, maybe go through the records of what has
happened, not only during our administration of six years but also when the
member for Dauphin (Mr. Plohman) was the minister there, I mean, go through the
whole history of it, I just want to say that I think there are positive things
that are developing in Churchill that will ultimately, I think, assure the fact
that we will have the line there.
Swan River, Manitoba
Rail Access
Ms. Rosann Wowchuk (Swan River):
My question is to the First Minister.
Since
the federal Liberal M.P. for the Dauphin‑Swan River area has indicated
that she feels no responsibility to keeping the Cowan subline open, which is
very important to the area both to farmers and other users of the area, will
this government give a commitment that they will stand behind the people of
Swan River and ensure that the Cowan subline, which is protected till the year
2000, will be reopened?
Hon. Gary Filmon (Premier):
The people of Swan River certainly know that this government stands
behind them. This is the government that
is working with them to ensure that they attract and are able to have 450 jobs
as a result of a forest products business that members in the New Democratic
caucus are opposed to.
This
is the government that is working with them to protect hundreds of jobs in the
PMU industry with the Ayerst plant that members in the NDP caucus are opposing.
This
is a government that is working to keep taxes down to ensure that the people of
Swan River have a better quality of life and a better ability to maintain all
sorts of things that are important to their families.
This
government will stand with the people of Swan River at all times.
* (1025)
CN Rail/CP Rail Merger
Impact on Employment
Mr. Daryl Reid (Transcona):
My question is for the Acting Minister of Highways and Transportation.
Despite
the promises by the federal government that Manitoba would be restored as a
rail transportation hub, 30 northern rail maintenance employees have received
layoff notices.
The
announcement that CN would cut 10,000 jobs has not been rescinded to this day,
Mr. Speaker. Since both CN and CP are
planning to merge operations from Winnipeg east, what studies has the
Department of Highways and Transportation undertaken to determine the impact on
rail jobs and rail service in the province of Manitoba.
Hon. Albert Driedger (Acting
Minister of Highways and Transportation): Mr. Speaker,
that question was raised to some degree in the last day or so. The Minister of Transportation (Mr. Findlay)
at that time indicated that he had been corresponding with CN on the
issue. This question is also not a new
question. This has been going on for a
long, long time, and we have made our position known very clearly.
I
again want to repeat, part of the issue that was raised in the budget was a
further reduction in the diesel fuel tax to make us competitive. I would suggest that the member for
Transcona, who is the critic of Highways and Transportion, support the budget
which basically puts them in a more positive, competitive position to deal with
these issues.
Mr. Reid:
Since this government has given back vital revenue to the province, back
to the railways by way of fuel tax reductions, what assurances did the Minister
of Highways and Transportation receive from the railways since he has met with
them that no more railway jobs would be lost in Manitoba?
What
assurances do we have that no more railway jobs would be lost since you have
given up this vital revenue?
Mr. Driedger:
Mr. Speaker, I want to tell the member, just to give him an indication
how this system works a little bit, by the reduction that this government put
on the diesel fuel tax last year, we ended up getting a whole bunch of jobs
through CP when they set up their system out here.
Mr.
Speaker, he claims that we are giving away money to the railways. If we are not going to be competitive, we are
not going to have the railway here. So
it is a matter of taking and working together with the railways.
The
concerns about jobs being gone and being moved, it has been in the mix for a
long time. We have constantly during my
tenure as well as the minister who is responsible right now‑‑we
have been working with the railways to make sure that the impact is going to be
as minimal as possible.
VIA Rail Purchase
Impact on Employment
Mr. Daryl Reid (Transcona):
Mr. Speaker, my final supplementary is to the same minister.
Considering
today's report that Railex wants to buy VIA Rail, lay off all its employees and
abandon nonprofitable service in western Canada, what action has the Minister
of Highways and Transportation taken to protect VIA jobs and routes in
Manitoba?
Hon. Albert Driedger (Acting
Minister of Highways and Transportation): Mr. Speaker,
I took the privilege of speaking with the Minister of Highways and
Transportation (Mr. Findlay) this morning.
As far as he can establish‑‑and we are trying to establish
whether there is some validity to do it‑‑it is just a rumour. I am not prepared to take and answer a
question on rumour.
* (1030)
Department of Education
Curriculum Development
Mr. John Plohman (Dauphin):
Mr. Speaker, people involved in education were shocked by this minister's
flip‑flop on a major issue involving curriculum development in this
province of Manitoba. I want to ask the
Minister of Education a question in light of the fact that over the last year
at least, he has literally destroyed‑‑he and his predecessor, the
former Minister of Education, have literally destroyed the Curriculum Branch
with the co‑ordinator, the director, either leaving or being fired. Many of the assistants that were there‑‑Joanne
Bevis, the gifted consultant, has left.
The guidance and child abuse prevention person, physical education
consultant, industrial arts consultant, the co‑ordinator for heritage
languages‑‑all of these professional people have left.
Now
this minister says that he is going to make curriculum development a major priority
in this province. I want to know how he
thinks he can have any credibility in developing curriculum after the record
that he has in curriculum in this province.
Hon. Clayton Manness (Minister of
Education and Training): Mr. Speaker, when members want
to talk about credibility, our Minister of Finance (Mr. Stefanson) brought down
a budget dealing with $5.5 billion giving a global fiscal picture of the
province last year and the future and, the second Question Period, not one
question with respect to the budget from the benches opposite. It shows you how good the budget was.
Some Honourable Members:
Hear, hear.
Mr. Speaker:
Order, please.
Point of Order
Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan):
Mr. Speaker, the $58‑million reduction in hospitals and personal
care nursing homes that I talked about in my question is partially as a result
of this budget.
Mr. Speaker:
Order, please. The honourable
member does not have a point of order.
That is clearly a dispute over the facts.
*
* *
Mr. Manness:
Mr. Speaker, the curriculum development branch certainly has gone
through a period of change. That was by
design. I know members opposite do not
take the view that sometimes you have to begin to build in efficiencies. You have to make some structural changes
internally and then build up from there.
That is what this government has been practising over the course of the
last two years. It is part of the plan.
I
dare say in Estimates I will have an opportunity to give greater explanation to
the increased funding that is presented in this year's budget.
Mr. Plohman:
Mr. Speaker, that was precisely a budget question.
Distance Education
Mr. John Plohman (Dauphin):
I want to ask the minister another budget question. He also says that distance education is a
major priority, and they are going to pump more money into‑‑and he
has just finished destroying the Distance Education Branch. As a matter of fact, it is not even listed in
the Estimates for the Department of Education any further. The director has been dismissed. The administrative officer, the co‑ordinator
for educational television have all left in the last year.
I
want to ask this minister, once again, how he thinks anyone is going to believe
that he has credibility in establishing this as a major priority after he has
destroyed that branch of that department.
Hon. Clayton Manness (Minister of
Education and Training): Mr. Speaker, I am not going to
embark upon a debate on credibility with the member for Dauphin.
The
member is mindful of the initiative this government is taking with respect to
Dr. Beth Cruickshank, who is dialoguing with all the school divisions in the
province, trying to lay into place for government a blueprint with respect to
the provision of educational technology services.
The
member and indeed the education community will be hearing much more about this
issue over the course of the next number of months. I say to the member, as I have said to school
divisions throughout the province, this government has embarked upon a
significant new approach to the provision of education services in rural
Manitoba, and it will be based significantly upon the advances within the area
of technology and education.
Staffing
Mr. John Plohman (Dauphin):
Mr. Speaker, is it not a fact‑‑I want to ask this minister‑‑that
he has dismissed long‑standing professionals and replaced them with
people hired under untendered political contracts, like Beth Cruickshank, at
$270 a day in an untendered contract? Is
that not a fact?
Hon. Clayton Manness (Minister of
Education and Training): Mr. Speaker, the member may have
done his own calculations. I am not
certain as to what the per diem rate is, but I can tell the member one thing. I am certain‑‑
An Honourable Member:
Table her contract.
Mr. Manness:
I will. When you formally ask for
it, I will.
What
I can say? At least something is being
done. There is a co‑ordination in
place. We have a plan. We are working towards a plan, not like what
we inherited from the former government, where there was disorder and chaos.
* (1035)
Department of Education
Student Services Branch
Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster):
Mr. Speaker, this government in its budget is talking about sharing the
pain.
I
would ask the Minister of Education to look at the Student Services branch,
where there was a cut of 22.5 percent.
The Student Services branch is there to provide programs for specialized
support through the services for consultants for hearing impaired and visually
impaired, to ensure students with special needs have access to specialized
equipment and materials, to facilitate interdepartmental co‑ordination of
services for students with special needs.
That is a 22.5 percent cut.
Do
we need less to co‑ordinate these services? Do we need less for equipment and
material? Do we need fewer consultants
for the hearing and the visually impaired?
Why did this government cut 22.5 percent from the people that need it
the most in the Department of Education?
Hon. Clayton Manness (Minister of
Education and Training): Mr. Speaker, what I have noticed
over the course of many years being involved in Budget Debates, when you do not
have the intellectual capacity and an understanding of the larger picture, what
you do is you pick out a line in an Estimates book that is that thick, you try
and look for a reduction and then you make it the essence of a question during
Question Period. That is the approach.
I
say to the member, the approach for this government for a long period of time
is try to reduce administrative costs, try to reduce the inefficiencies and
provide the same level of service for fewer dollars. That is the approach that has been practised. That is why this party will stay in
government on this side of the House, and that is why the members that are over
there now will stay there.
Mr. Lamoureux:
Mr. Speaker, what balderdash.
This government is talking about sharing the pain. What is this government doing to the people
that need it the most in education?
I
will ask the question to the Minister of Education. How does he determine that this is fair, this
is sharing the pain when you are penalizing the individuals that need to have
the consultants, need to have the material?
Why do you penalize them by cutting 22.5 percent?
Mr. Manness:
Mr. Speaker, my honourable friend the member for Inkster can scream and
holler as loudly as he wants. The path
that this government has followed in all its decisions is to try to reduce
overlap and duplication and inefficiency and maintain the levels of
services. That is what I am saying in
respect to this detailed question for the member opposite. That is the course we have been on.
Estimates
review, which will probably last six or seven weeks, will provide the member an
opportunity to ask all of the detailed questions. I dare say to him, the answer to almost all
of the questions posed will again talk about the way we have restructured
internally to save taxpayer dollars and yet to maintain the level of service to
the education community in our province.