LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA
Thursday, October 8, 2009
ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS
Long-Term Care Facilities–Morden and Winkler
Mr. Peter Dyck (Pembina): I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly.
These are the reasons for this petition.
Many seniors from the Morden and Winkler area are currently patients in Boundary Trails Health Centre while they wait for placement in local personal care homes.
There are presently no beds available for these patients in Salem Home and Tabor Home. To make more beds in the hospital available, the regional health authority is planning to move these patients to personal care homes in outlying regions.
These patients have lived, worked and raised their families in this area for most of their lives. They receive care and support from their family and friends who live in the community, and they will lose this support if they are forced to move to distant communities.
These seniors and their families should not have to bear the consequences of the provincial government's failure to ensure there are adequate personal care home beds in the region.
We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:
To urge the Minister of Health (Ms. Oswald) to ensure that patients who are awaiting placement in a personal care home are not moved to distant communities.
To urge the Minister of Health to consider working with the RHA and the community to speed construction and expansion of the long-term care facilities in the region.
This is signed by Lynda Penner, Joe Lesprance, Tracey Whale and many, many others.
Mr. Speaker: In accordance with our rule 132(6), when petitions are read they are deemed to be received by the House.
PTH 15
Mr. Ron Schuler (Springfield): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.
These are the reasons for this petition.
In 2004, the Province of Manitoba made a public commitment to the people of Springfield to twin PTH 15 and the floodway bridge on PTH 15, but then in 2006, the twinning was cancelled.
Injuries resulting from the collisions on PTH 15 continue to rise and have doubled from 2007 to 2008.
In August 2008, the Minister of Transportation (Mr. Lemieux) stated that preliminary analysis of current and future traffic demands indicate that local twinning will be required.
The current plan to replace the floodway bridge on PTH 15 does not include twinning and, therefore, does not fulfil the current nor future traffic demands cited by the Minister of Transportation.
We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:
To request that the Minister of Transportation consider the immediate twinning of the PTH 15 floodway bridge for the safety of the citizens of Manitoba.
Signed by Doug Raynard, Louise Bass, Juergen Hartmann and many, many other Manitobans.
Parkland Regional Health Authority–Ambulance Station
Mr. Stuart Briese (Ste. Rose): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.
These are the reasons for this petition:
The communities of Eddystone, Bacon Ridge and Ebb and Flow First Nation rely on emergency medical services personnel based in Ste. Rose, which is about 45 minutes away.
These communities represent about 2,500 people. Other communities of similar size within the region are equipped with at least one ambulance, but this area is not. As a result, residents must be transported in private vehicles to the nearest hospital if they cannot wait for emergency personnel to arrive.
There are qualified first responders living in these communities who want to serve the region but need an ambulance to do so.
A centrally located ambulance and ambulance station in this area would be able to provide better and more responsive emergency services to these communities.
We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:
To urge the Minister of Health (Ms. Oswald) to consider working with the Parkland Regional Health Authority to provide a centrally located ambulance station in the area of Eddystone, Bacon Ridge and Ebb and Flow First Nation.
This petition is signed by Nadine Shuttleworth, Kathleen Desjarlais, Robert Desjarlais and many, many other fine Manitobans.
Whiteshell Provincial Park–Lagoons
Mrs. Heather Stefanson (Tuxedo): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly.
And these are the reasons for this petition:
Manitoba's provincial parks were established to protect our natural resources and the environment for future generations.
In July 2009 the lagoons in the vicinity of Dorothy Lake and Otter Falls in the Whiteshell Provincial Park overflowed, creating concerns that the untreated sewage made its way into the Winnipeg River system and ultimately into Lake Winnipeg.
In addition, emergency discharges had to be undertaken at lagoons in the Whiteshell Provincial Park four times in 2005, once in 2007 and once in April of 2009.
Concerned stakeholders in the Whiteshell Provincial Park have repeatedly asked the provincial government to develop plans to address the shortcomings with the park's lagoons and to ensure the environment is protected, but the plans have not materialized.
We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:
To request the Minister of Conservation (Mr. Struthers) to consider acknowledging that more timely action should have been taken to address the shortcomings with the lagoons in the Whiteshell Provincial Park in order to protect the environment.
To request the Minister of Conservation to consider immediately developing short- and long-term strategies to address the shortcomings with lagoons in the Whiteshell Provincial Park and to consider implementing them as soon as possible.
And Mr. Speaker, this petition is signed by Darren Juby, Ross Teague, Marilyn Brown and many, many others.
Virden Health Centre–Health-Care Services
Mr. Larry Maguire (Arthur-Virden): Mr. Speaker, I would like to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly.
And these are the reasons for this petition:
The Virden and district hospital is the only active hospital serving a large catchment area.
Doctors' services are being provided to communities within the Virden catchment area by doctors who are based in Moosomin, Saskatchewan.
The chronic shortage of doctors in the Virden clinic has forced several residents to seek family physician services in Moosomin and various other centres in Manitoba.
The functioning operating room at the Virden and district hospital has been closed and the room turned into an ARHA supply distribution centre.
We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:
To request the Minister of Health (Ms. Oswald) to consider increasing the number of doctors and nurses in the Virden and district hospital to ensure stable quality health care for the Virden catchment area.
To request the Minister of Health to consider establishing a walk-in clinic in the Virden and district hospital.
To request the Minister of Health to consider developing a specialized health-care service for the Virden and district hospital.
To request the Minister of Health to consider reopening the Virden and district hospital operating room.
And this petition is signed by Anna Sproule, Maureen Lloyd-Davies, Karan Galbraith, Glenn Ross and many, many others, Mr. Speaker.
Seven Oaks Hospital–Emergency Services
Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Yes, Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the following petition to the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba.
The background to this petition is as follows:
The current Premier (Mr. Doer) and the NDP government are reducing emergency services at the Seven Oaks Hospital.
On October the 6th, 1995, the NDP introduced a matter of urgent public importance that stated that, quote, "the ordinary business of the House to be set aside to discuss a matter of urgent public importance, namely the threat to the health-care system posed by this government's plans to limit emergency services in the city of Winnipeg community hospitals." End of quote.
On December the 6th, 1995, when the then-PC government suggested it was going to reduce emergency services at the Seven Oaks Hospital, the NDP leader then asked Premier Gary Filmon to, quote, "reverse the horrible decisions of his government and his Minister of Health and reopen our community-based emergency wards." End of quote.
The NDP gave Manitobans the impression that they supported Seven Oaks Hospital having full emergency services seven days a week, 24 hours a day
We petition the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba as follows:
To request that the Premier of Manitoba consider how important it is to have the Seven Oaks Hospital provide full emergency service seven days a week, 24 hours a day.
Mr. Speaker, this is signed by D. Valdez, N. Robinson and V. Lamirande and many, many other fine Manitobans.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Leonard Derkach (Chairperson): Mr. Speaker, I wish to present the Eighth Report on the Standing Committee of Public Accounts.
Madam Clerk (Patricia Chaychuk): Your Standing Committee on Public Accounts–
Some Honourable Members: Dispense.
Mr. Speaker: Dispense? Dispense.
Your Standing Committee on Public Accounts presents the following as its Eighth Report.
Meetings
Your Committee met on the following occasions:
· November 28, 2005
· October 7, 2009
Matters under Consideration
· Auditor General's Report – Aiyawin Corporation: The Consequences of Mismanagement in a Shared Responsibility Framework – March 2006
· Auditor General's Report – Investigation of the Maintenance Branch of the Manitoba Housing Authority dated November 2004
Committee Membership
Committee Membership for the November 28, 2005 meeting:
· Mr. Caldwell
· Mr. Cummings
· Mr. Hawranik
· Mr. Maguire
· Mr. Maloway (Vice-Chairperson)
· Mr. Martindale
· Mr. Nevakshonoff
· Mr. Reimer (Chairperson)
· Mr. Santos
· Hon. Mr. Selinger
Committee Membership for the October 7, 2009 meeting:
· Mr. Borotsik
· Mr. Derkach (Chairperson)
· Ms. Howard (Vice-Chairperson)
· Mr. Jha
· Mr. Lamoureux
· Mr. Maguire
· Ms. Marcelino
· Mr. Martindale
· Ms. Selby
· Mrs. Stefanson
· Hon. Ms. Wowchuk
Officials Speaking on Record
Officials speaking on the record at the October 7, 2009 meeting:
· Carol Bellringer, Auditor General
· Mr. Martin Billinkoff, Deputy Minister of Family Services and Housing
· Jack Buckwold, Director of Special Audits, Office of the Auditor General
Reports Considered and Passed
Your Committee considered and passed the following reports as presented:
· Auditor General's Report – Aiyawin Corporation: The Consequences of Mismanagement in a Shared Responsibility Framework – March 2006
· Auditor General's Report – Investigation of the Maintenance Branch of the Manitoba Housing Authority dated November 2004
Mr. Derkach: Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable member of Springfield, that the report be–of the committee be received.
Motion agreed to.
Hon. Ron Lemieux (Minister of Infrastructure and Transportation): Mr. Speaker, I'm pleased to table the following reports: Manitoba Infrastructure and Transportation's Annual Report 2008-2009, as well as Manitoba Water Services Board's Annual Report 2008-2009. Merci, Monsieur le président. [Thank you, Mr. Speaker.]
Hon. Stan Struthers (Minister of Conservation): Mr. Speaker, it's my pleasure to–it's my pleasure to table the 2008-2009 Annual Report of the Manitoba Product Stewardship Corporation.
Hon. Dave Chomiak (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): I'm pleased to table the following report, the Manitoba Justice, Criminal Justice Division, Victims Services Complaints Annual Report 2008-2009.
Hon. Christine Melnick (Minister of Water Stewardship): I'd like to table the Manitoba Conservation Districts 2008-2009 Annual Report, as well as the Manitoba Water Stewardship 2008-2009 Annual Report.
Hon. Peter Bjornson (Minister of Education, Citizenship and Youth): I'm pleased to table the Manitoba Education, Citizenship and Youth Annual Report 2008-2009.
Hon. Kerri Irvin-Ross (Minister of Healthy Living): I am pleased to table the 2008-2009 Annual Report for the Addictions Foundation of Manitoba.
Hon. Andrew Swan (Minister of Competitiveness, Training and Trade): Mr. Speaker, I'm pleased to table the Annual Report for the Manitoba Development Corporation for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2009, and the Annual Report for the Manitoba Opportunities Fund Limited for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2009.
Introduction of Guests
Mr. Speaker: Order. Prior to oral questions, I'd like to draw the attention of the honourable members to the loge to my left where we have with us Mr. Jim Carr, who is the former member for Fort Rouge and Crescentwood.
On behalf of all the members, I welcome you here.
And also, in the public gallery, we have from Faith Academy, we have 22 grade 9 students under the direction of Mr. Mike Ringham. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable Minister for Family Services and Housing (Mr. Mackintosh).
On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you here today.
Government Record
Mr. Hugh McFadyen (Leader of the Official Opposition): Mr. Speaker, of the many–the many roles that the Premier played over the last 10 years, he was known in some circles as the minister of everything. Some called it a one-man–a one-man show. But of the many roles he played, the one that I think we appreciated the least was his self-appointed role as the historian, the official House historian of the 1990s.
Now, Mr. Speaker, out of curiosity, in connection with some of his comments about the 1990s, we went back and stumbled across a document that he had put out dated September 1, 1999, and in that document the Premier said, and I quote, he would end hallway medicine within six months with $15 million in new spending. We were shocked to stumble across this document that was released just over 10 years ago.
Ten years on and $2.2 billion, I just wanna ask the Premier: How is he making out on that promise?
Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): You know–you know, I wanna thank the Leader of the Opposition for being so predictable day after day after day. I said–I said to the Minister of Justice (Mr. Chomiak), he's going to ask the question from the 1999 election. He can't get over it. He was the chief of staff. He was the campaign manager. He can't get over the 1999 election. And the Minister of Justice says, oh, no, he's gonna take the high road. I said, no, he's not gonna do that. He won't do that.
As many times as he wants to re-fight the '99 election, we still win it. We still win it, and, you know what? He might even ask a question about the 2003 election or the 2007 election, but he is still very, very predictable, and I thank him for that on behalf of people on our side. Thank you very much.
Mr. McFadyen: Mr. Speaker, I wanna just accept the compliment from the Premier for being predictable, and I wanna compliment him on his modesty today. It really is–it really is a remarkable–a remarkable display. And I know he will be missed almost as much by members on this side of the House as he will be by members on that side.
And I wanna ask the Premier one other thing that he said at the time, and we had completely forgotten about this one. But the other–the other thing that he said at the time in 1999, was that he was gonna take money in the health-care system; he was gonna take it out of boardrooms and put it into emergency rooms. In the meantime, they've closed 18 rural emergency rooms and they put a lot of money into fancy new boardrooms down on Main Street.
And I just wanna ask the Premier: What led to that mix-up in that 1999 promise?
Mr. Doer: Again, it's got nothing to do with the confidence and modesty, it's got everything to do with democracy. And, Mr. Speaker, the issue, 'cause we're all–we're all ultimately accountable–
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Speaker: Order. Order. Order. Order.
Mr. Doer: Thank you very much. We're all ultimately accountable to the people, and that's a good thing.
Mr. Speaker, the issues of health care have been dominant in the '99 election, the 2003 election and 2007 election. And we'll take the barbs from members opposite, but we'll take the advice and the judgments of people in every constituency that we represent in those election campaigns. That's ultimately in a democracy where each and every one of us are accountable. And that's why I–it's been a great privilege to serve the people of Manitoba in '99, 2003 and 2007. Ultimately, it's the people that decide who is accountable and how they're accountable, and that's why we're very confident as we move forward after 10 years in government into the next period of time with renewal, with energy, with policy and great people moving Manitoba forward.
Senate Reform
Premier's Opinion
Mr. Hugh McFadyen (Leader of the Official Opposition): I know in light of the–some of the activities in relation to their pressure on Elections Manitoba, I think it's a dangerous thing to get into, comments about respect for democracy, Mr. Speaker.
But all of that aside, we've disagreed on many things over the years. We've agreed on many things as well. Those areas of agreement don't get referred to quite as often.
But I wanna just ask the Premier, in a bit of a segue from health care, if he can just shed light on his views on the issue of Senate reform in light of today's development.
Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, this is one regret I really do have as we're leaving–I'm leaving this particular office. I have always maintained–in fact, we had three out of four western premiers at one point–that Manitoba was wise to have abolished the second Chamber in 1875.
An Honourable Member: 1876.
Mr. Doer: 1875? Okay. And to make sure that–or so–
An Honourable Member: He was there.
Mr. Doer: I was not–well, you might have been there. I don't know–Mr. Speaker, but there's nothing wrong with that. We don't wanna be ageist in this Chamber–especially I don't wanna be.
But, Mr. Speaker, I can't believe that the idea of appearing as a Justice Minister before the Senate to call on the judge's decision to be amended in the Criminal Code, a position supported by all the elected members in the House of Parliament, would be overridden by a Senate proposal just last evening.
We believe that the Senate should be abolished. And if we ever want a case for the Senate being abolished, we just saw it last evening. Elected people in the Legislatures of this country, elected people in the House of Parliament should be making decisions and be accountable to the citizens of Canada, to the citizens of Manitoba, and that's what should happen with the Senate here in this country.
Violent Crime
Government Record
Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Steinbach): On this occasion it looks like we agree. We don't think that the Senate should be soft on crime and tough on elected officials, Mr. Speaker.
Over the last 10 years though, there have been a number of issues around crime in this province in increases in gangs and increases in violence. We've seen increases in handguns and increases of illegal weapons on the streets of Winnipeg and in Manitoba. Instead of national headlines saying we're friendly Manitoba, we've seen headlines saying that we're the murder capital–shootings, gangland attacks, citizens looking for vigilante justice.
* (13:50)
I want the Premier (Mr. Doer) to tell us, if he will acknowledge, as he packs to go to Washington, whether or not he believes that Manitoba is safer today than it was in 1999.
Hon. Dave Chomiak (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): Mr. Speaker, I certainly–I certainly know that the fact that we have 200 more officers on the street than when we came into office has assured the people of Manitoba. I certainly know that we've been increasing prosecutions–the number of prosecutors that we have providing for prosecutions by something like 40 percent, has contributed. I'm certain the fact that we have increased our capacity in jails but, you know–and recognized that gangs are the problems, not ignoring them as happened in the '90s.
The most important thing, the most important thing that we have to continue working on is education, dealing with poverty, Mr. Speaker, and dealing with people so they're not in the circumstances where they can become vulnerable, vulnerable to those gangs and those groups out there that take advantage of young people and put them out to prostitution, trafficking and all the hideous things that happen in our society. It's the gangs that we're after.
Mr. Speaker: Order.
Mr. Goertzen: Well, Mr. Speaker, we've seen what the NDP's contribution has been to fighting crime; they unplugged the gang data base. They let prosecution workloads grow. They're letting the court backlogs grow. They're allowing more drugs on the street, more illegal weapons on the street. They've been weak on bail, and they've let our prisons become a powder keg. On and on it has gone. In fact, it's ironic that the most successful piece of legislation that they trumpeted over the last 10 years was The Safer Communities Act brought in by the former Conservative government.
As this Premier–as this Premier prepares to depart for Washington, will he acknowledge that today Manitoba is less safe than it was 10 years ago?
Mr. Chomiak: To the member for Steinbach, who was the chair of the Tory campaign last time that had one platform, one item, he drove in from Steinbach to say they want to build a jail, and their budget was, like, $40 million–
An Honourable Member: Over four years.
Mr. Chomiak: –over four years to spend, and they voted against every single budget and every prosecutor we brought in, and that member was chair of the campaign committee. We only hope he's chair of the campaign committee next time, Mr. Speaker, because he says a lot in this House, but he doesn't get a lot done.
Mr. Goertzen: He better be careful. I'm going to let the Senate know where he is, Mr. Speaker.
Since the Premier is about to become a resident of the United States, he should look to an example to one of our American neighbours, Minneapolis. Over the past three years, Minneapolis has reduced its violent crime rate by 30 percent and has cut its murder rate in half. You know, they didn't do it with new laws, Mr. Speaker, they didn't do it with phony press announcements like the members opposite. They didn't do it with rhetoric in the Legislature. You know, it's funny, they did it by cracking down on criminals. What a unique idea from our neighbours to the south.
Will the Premier learn from the lessons from Minneapolis? Will he tell his Minister of Justice, on his last day, that he needs to start cracking down on criminals and not simply cracking down on the Senate, Mr. Speaker?
Mr. Chomiak: Well, we have a good case in point, Mr. Speaker, when we realized that auto theft had gone out of control. We put in place a program called the WATSS, the auto theft program. It has reduced auto theft in Winnipeg by 60 percent.
In fact, the group is going to–the group is going to California in the beginning of November as a finalist in a North American world contest on how to deal with crime and safety, and MPI and the police are going down as representatives to probably accept that reward, Mr. Speaker. And I want to thank the police service. I want to thank MPI. I want to thank the men and women of Manitoba who said, when you take a targeted crime area, you put in a supportive program that deals with, not just locking them up, but providing alternatives and getting them off the street and looking at it intensely. You can reduce it by 60 percent. We've done it with auto theft. We're doing it with gangs, just watch us.
Child Welfare System
Worker Caseloads
Mrs. Bonnie Mitchelson (River East): Since 1999, under this Premier's (Mr. Doer) watch, we've seen chaos in the Child and Family Services system: children dying horrific deaths, review after review, hundreds of recommendations and, Mr. Speaker, things are getting worse, not better.
Last year, according to the minister, front-line caseloads were 28 to 29. This year, according to a FIPPA request, caseloads have increased to an average of 38, in some cases, as high as 58.
Mr. Speaker, after pouring millions of dollars into a system that's out of control, why are we seeing children's safety being put at greater risk as a result of unsafe, unmanageable caseloads for front-line workers?
Hon. Andrew Swan (Acting Minister of Family Services and Housing): Mr. Speaker, certainly this government is doing what it can to improve the child welfare system with the Changes for Children initiative, which is putting more resources into front‑line social workers, more resources into foster parents, more resources for adoptive parents.
It is very ironic, it's the member for River East standing and asking this question because when she was the minister responsible for child welfare in the 1990s, the child welfare system was in crisis, and at that time–at that time, the minister refused to be accountable for caseloads that were 44 to 80 cases per social worker and, when asked about these high caseloads, she said it wasn't her responsibility. She stood in this House, May 25, 1998, and said Winnipeg Child and Family Services, an externally funded and managed agency.
We are responsible. We are committed. We are improving the child welfare system in Manitoba.
Mrs. Mitchelson: This is all about a government after 10 years that talks about spending more, Mr. Speaker, and getting less. Three years ago, the Doer government announced an $11.5-million fund to hire 150 more social workers.
Where are they, Mr. Speaker? Why have caseloads escalated so dramatically over the last year when they've poured more resources in and they're getting less support?
Mr. Swan: As I said, this government is committed through Changes for Children to making sure that appropriate services are in place when children are in–are in need and certainly over the past number of years, we've made sure that protection is the No. 1 criteria when taking into account the children's situations.
So indeed, there are more children in care than there were two or three years ago, but we are continuing to make improvements to the system. We're continuing to support and to respect our front-line social workers, something which was sorely lacking when the Conservative Party was in power. [interjection] And I hear them moaning and groaning, but this is all about children. This government cares about children wherever they happen to be in the province of Manitoba, unlike the government of the 1990s, Mr. Speaker.
Mrs. Mitchelson: But that kind of an answer is cold comfort to Gage Guimond, to Phoenix Sinclair, to Tracia Owen and those, Mr. Speaker, that have lost their lives in this government's child and welfare system, under this Premier's watch.
Mr. Speaker, in September of 2008, we asked under FIPPA for caseload numbers, 2008. In September, 2009, one year later, we got a response, and that was only after the Ombudsman directed this government to provide those figures.
Why such secrecy, Mr. Speaker? Why is this Doer government trying to hide its failure to improve the safety and protection of vulnerable children under their watch?
Mr. Swan: As every member of this House is aware, there have been a number of external reviews done with Child and Family Services and this government has implemented and, more importantly, has funded the recommendations of these external reviews, as well as the review into the tragic death of Gage Guimond, and we have a multi-year plan of action which is transforming our child welfare system, and we're moving forward to repair a system which has had challenges for a long, long time, Mr. Speaker.
And Manitoba's overhaul of the child welfare system has been recognized not just here in Manitoba but in other jurisdictions, and in February, in a report on foster care, the Children's Advocate of Saskatchewan said that Manitoba is, indeed, a leader when it comes to solving issues in child welfare, and I quote the Children's Advocate in Saskatchewan: "The Manitoba example shows that this issue can be solved; there just needs to be the collective political and administrative will to do so."
I am very proud, as is every member on this side of the House, of the work we've done to protect children in the province of Manitoba.
* (14:00)
Provincial Debt
Increase
Mr. Rick Borotsik (Brandon West): Mr. Speaker, a legacy is usually measured by what you leave your children. Parents always want to leave their children better off than what they themselves were left. In Manitoba, this Premier (Mr. Doer) and the former Finance Minister missed that lesson. They left Manitobans with a legacy of a mountain of debt. Net debt at year end, March 2009, was $11.5 billion. This is a whopping $900-million increase from the previous year.
Now that the Premier is leaving, will the new Finance Minister commit to controlling this government's terrible addiction to debt?
Hon. Rosann Wowchuk (Minister of Finance): Mr. Speaker, the member opposite again is doom and gloom. I wish he would look at what others are saying. I wish he would listen to what the Royal Bank is saying today. The Royal Bank has said Manitoba is outperforming other provinces. There is growth in this province and there is confidence in the consumers of this province. If you look at the statistics from last year when the recession was beginning to where the consumers are today, the consumers are more confident in this economy than the member opposite would have them believe.
This government will not accept that we should not be investing so that the economy can keep on going so people can work and people will have confidence in this economy.
Mr. Borotsik: Mr. Speaker, consumers are confident because they're reducing their debt loads, not increasing it. Manitoba's net debt has gone from $7.6 billion to $11.5 billion during this Premier's term. He's leaving when his government is facing a $600-million deficit and a massive reduction in equalization payments that will add another billion dollars to the debt of Manitoba. On top of that perfect storm, record low interests are on the rise. Australia just raised its interest rates, and Canada will be sure to follow. For every 1 percent increase in interest rates it's gonna cost the Manitoba Treasury $110 million taken out of services.
How is the new Finance Minister gonna control that downward spiral?
Ms. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, the member opposite wants to talk about debt, but he will not talk about the fact that when the Conservatives were in government there was two sets of books. They kept debt off the books. This government has gone to one set of books, and all of the assets and all of the expenses and the debt are all in one set of books. And the member opposite can paint doom and gloom and where financing are going, I will take the word of the CEO of the Bank of Canada who, yesterday, said that Manitoba is well positioned for growth for the same reasons that the Canadian banks are: stability. The economic growth for Manitoba, the Royal Bank is forecasting it will be one of the–the only province to have grown in–[interjection]–the only province in 2009. There are–that creates many opportunities.
The member opposite wants doom and gloom rather than saying Manitoba is a good place to be.
Mr. Borotsik: Mr. Speaker, the new Finance Minister can put her head in the sand. This isn't doom and gloom; this is a reality. Operating debt is only part of the story. When they add in Manitoba Hydro debt, it paints an even bleaker picture. Manitobans are on the hook–on the hook for $21.2 billion. Even the Public Utilities Board is waving red flags at the continued risk of Manitoba Hydro's inability to manage its own fiscal affairs. The Premier is right when he said he should get out while the going is good. Unfortunately, the rest of us have to stay and fix this mess and pay for his problems.
Is the new Finance Minister gonna stay or is she gonna take the Premier's easy way out and leave too?
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, I wonder whether the member opposite–[interjection]
Mr. Speaker: Order.
Ms. Wowchuk: –is gonna leave or whether he's gonna stay.
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Ms. Wowchuk: I believe he wants to leave. He has no faith in Manitoba, Mr. Speaker, no hope.
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Speaker: Order.
Ms. Wowchuk: The member opposite talks about Hydro. I know that they would privatize it. The members opposite said the same thing about telephone, and then they sold it, and then their friends made a lot of money on it. Mr. Speaker, I will take the word of Gordon Nixon, CEO of the Royal Bank of Canada, who said yesterday that Manitoba is growing, not what the member opposite is saying.
Members opposite–the people of Manitoba have confidence in this economy. The banks have confidence in this economy. Only the member opposite is doom and gloom about Manitoba. I'll bet he's leaving, Mr. Speaker.
Waste-Water Treatment Facilities (Winnipeg)
Nitrogen Removal
Mrs. Heather Stefanson (Tuxedo): Mr. Speaker, in the last 10 years, the size of the provincial operating budget has increased some 67 percent in Manitoba, and what has this government got to show for it?
Mr. Speaker, children continue to fall through the cracks in our child welfare system, debt continues to rise, wait times for health-care services are on the rise, gangs are running rampant on our streets. Quite the legacy for this government.
Recently this government introduced two more projects, Mr. Speaker: the west-side Bipole III line and nitrogen removal in Winnipeg's waste-water treatment facilities. These projects will unnecessarily cost Manitoba taxpayers an extra $1.5 billion. That's roughly $1,500 for every man, woman and child in this province.
These two–the two people currently running for the NDP leadership were part of the legacy–this legacy of waste in management. How can–how can Manitobans be assured that this bleeding will stop under either of their leadership?
Hon. Stan Struthers (Minister of Conservation): Mr. Speaker, when it comes to protecting Manitoba's water, Calgary gets it, Regina gets it, Brandon gets it, the City of Winnipeg actually gets it. I mean, they've been removing nitrogen from the West End plant already. The City of Winnipeg has increased water rates, and they're setting aside money to accomplish this. Who doesn't get it? Who is left? Members opposite.
Mrs. Stefanson: Well, apparently, one of the leadership candidates, the NDP actually gets it. The member for St. Boniface (Mr. Selinger) said, and I quote, when asked about revisiting the N and P removal debate in the city of Winnipeg, he said, and I quote: If you're asking me if I'll take a third look at it, the short answer is yes.
My question is for the Premier (Mr. Doer): Will he stand before us today, and will he do what the next potential leader of this NDP party is, will he pre-empt this and revisit this issue so that millions and millions of dollars are not wasted unnecessarily on this projects?
Mr. Struthers: That's pretty sweet coming from the people across the way who, in the early '90s, were told they should do something about this problem, and they ignored it for over a decade, Mr. Speaker, over a decade.
In 2003, we were responsible enough to go to the CEC and say, what should be done on this? Then we actually listened to their recommendations. Members opposite, again, were out of touch. So we did it again. Now in the more recent times, the CEC comes back to us, and says, here's what you should do: remove nitrogen, go hard on phosphorus. We agreed. We're moving forward; you're left behind.
Mrs. Stefanson: Mr. Speaker, unfortunately, the legacy of this Premier is fast becoming the deterioration of the health of Lake Winnipeg, and I think that's extremely unfortunate. The Premier has this–has the chance to stand before us today. A future leader, a potential leader, of the NDP has already said that he will revisit this issue.
Will the NDP current leader, the Premier of this province, do the right thing? Revisit this issue so that millions upon millions of taxpayer dollars are not wasted unnecessarily, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Struthers: Right through to the last day of our session, the Tories show they just don't get this, Mr. Speaker. It's about water protection. The legacy on this side is very clear. Every angle that we looked at, we have taken the approach that we're gonna protect water and every single–every single regulation we brought forward, backed up by the Clean Environment Commission, I want to add, yet again, every single one of these proactive protection of water initiatives, you voted against.
Manitoba Hydro
Risk Analysis Report
Mr. Hugh McFadyen (Leader of the Official Opposition): It's not us that is raising the concern about the waste-water waste, Mr. Speaker, it's the experts like Dr. David Schindler, from Alberta, and a variety of other scientists, who have lined up to say that the removal of nitrogen, not only will cost tens or hundreds of millions of dollars, but it may actually make Lake Winnipeg even worse than it already is.
Another group of experts at Manitoba Hydro are now sounding the alarm, that because of waste and mismanagement at Hydro and political interference, the 75-25 debt equity number is based on a miscalculation, that the company is taking risks that may endanger ratepayers in Manitoba in terms of their financial position.
I wanna ask the minister responsible for Manitoba Hydro: Will they release the analysis done by these hydro experts? Will they be forthcoming with Manitobans about the level of risk that hydro ratepayers, many of whom are seniors on fixed incomes, will face as a result of the mismanagement and political interference of this NDP government?
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Hon. Rosann Wowchuk (Minister charged with the administration of The Manitoba Hydro Act): Mr. Speaker, the member has raised this issue before, and I can quote for him what the president or CEO of Hydro said at the standing committee. He said: Manitoba Hydro is definitely in real good shape. There's no doubt about it.
Mr. Speaker, Hydro is in good shape, and we are making investments so Hydro–[interjection]
The members opposite should have confidence–
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Speaker: Order.
Ms. Wowchuk: –in the CEO of Manitoba Hydro.
Mr. Speaker: Order.
Ms. Wowchuk: The Tories did appoint him and we have continued on, and we have confidence in him as well. And he has been asked these questions before at the CEC–at the standing committee meetings, Mr. Speaker, and he has indicated that there is confidence in where Hydro's financials are.
And Hydro will continue to build hydro dams and build Bipole III so that we have reliability in our power supply and in our–
Mr. Speaker: Order.
Mr. McFadyen: We have confidence in the CEO of Hydro when he says that the next bipole line ought to be built down the east side of Lake Winnipeg, when that same CEO said that he would never recommend building a major transmission line through a flood zone, which they are proposing to do by running the lines south of Winnipeg across the Red River. Mr. Speaker, we believe that the CEO is right, that you should not build major transmission lines through zones that flood on a regular basis.
And we would have a lot more confidence in this government's management and oversight of Manitoba Hydro if they would release the documents related to the analysis that was done that shows the 75-25 debt equity ratio is based on a miscalculation, that there's been massive waste and mismanagement, that the forecasting is off, that we would have more confidence if they would simply release the analysis.
Will they, today, release that analysis and restore our confidence in their oversight of Hydro?
Ms. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, we said that we had confidence in the CEO. The CEO is a–is an accountant, and he has said that the debt ratio is 75 and–
An Honourable Member: It was 85.
Ms. Wowchuk: Oh, under the previous administration it was 85, Mr. Speaker. So there are improvements. Hydro is generating revenue and those–and we have, of course, we have the lowest hydro rates in the country.
Mr. Speaker, this is a good corporation, and this–the member opposite talks about the Bipole III line, he forgets that this was debated in the last election. We said that we would take bipole on the west side of the province. We won that election, and people have given us their confidence that that's where the line should go.
Mr. McFadyen: Mr. Speaker, the last statement by the minister is categorically wrong. She missed it by one word. What the Premier (Mr. Doer) said on CBC during the election campaign was that the line will not go down the west side of the province, not that it will, it's what he said on CBC. It's there for all to see.
And then, shortly afterward, on the first day of session, they had Hydro slip out a news release trying to put it under the radar hoping no one would notice, Mr. Speaker.
And I want to ask the minister, who's refusing to release the internal analysis, why is it that the PUB has now asked, more than a year ago, for an outside independent expert to assess the company's risk? And, according to the newspaper today, Hydro is stalling again on a plan to hire an outside independent expert that's been asked for by the PUB since the summer of 2008. Why all the stalling when it comes to the analysis of risk at Manitoba's most important Crown corporation?
Ms. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, it seems that the member opposite now wants us to interfere. That CEO of Hydro has the report.
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Speaker: I can't even hear you talking. Order. We need to be able to hear the questions and the answers, please.
The honourable minister has the floor.
Ms. Wowchuk: Mr. Speaker, the PUB is in discussion with Hydro. We don't testify before the PUB. The CEO, Mr. Brennan, will testify before the PUB. He will have those discussions and he will provide them with the information that they need.
And, according to the Auditor, the PUB investigation is going, and she's satisfied with that, Mr. Speaker. So I'm not sure what the member opposite wants.
I know he doesn't like Hydro. I know if he had the ability he would privatize Hydro like they did telephone, Mr. Speaker, but we have committed not to privatizing Hydro and making investments so that Manitobans can have the lowest hydro rates, can have reliability of supply and have clean energy.
Provincial Issues
Government Record
Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Speaker, to the Premier: Even after 10 years of trying, the Premier has sure left a lot of problems, major problems for his successors.
North of Selkirk, many homes which were flooded this last spring still don't have dikes. The H1N1 flu is coming and this government has been sending a lot of mixed messages and confusing messages. Hog producers are in trouble. Farmers in the Interlake and some in the Red River Valley are in desperate straits. Lakes like Lake Winnipeg and Killarney Lake have more problems with algal blooms, not less; severe erosion at places like Sagkeeng and elsewhere on Lake Winnipeg. Workers are on strike at Pine Falls, Manitoba Hydro, and Greyhound is threatening to shut down, and Devils Lake is threatening to overflow. Employment in manufacturing has decreased by tens of thousands.
Why is the Premier leaving Manitoba with so many problems?
Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Well, Mr. Speaker, I know there's lots of rhetoric in the Leader of the Opposition's (Mr. McFadyen) questions. I would ask him to follow the advice of the mayor from Leaf Rapids about being too extreme in his positions. I know he wasn't going to ask a question about the two-for-one today, considering what happened in the Senate.
But I would point out, Mr. Speaker, I would point out to the member that in terms of just one part of his question, it is interesting, we took a controversial position on stopping the expansion of the hog industry in vulnerable areas of southeast Manitoba, in the Red River Valley, in the Interlake area. I know that that policy, even though it's tough, even though it was opposed by Liberals, will have some validity with people living in the Interlake. I know it has some validity with people on and concerned about Lake Winnipeg.
You can't be concerned about the flooding in the Red River Valley with this kind of material on one moment and have, on the other hand, a position against the expansion in that vulnerable area, Mr. Speaker.
We have consistency of our positions and that's what the public know in the long run, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Gerrard: Consistently mistaken, misleading.
Je demande au Premier ministre (M. Doer) pourquoi il quitte la province en laissant un si grand nombre de problèmes. Pourquoi le Premier ministre part-il du Manitoba alors qu'il y a de si graves problèmes liés avec la grippe H1N1, aux agriculteurs de la région Entre-les-lacs et au rivière Rouge, aux éleveurs de porc, avec nos lacs comme le lac Winnipeg, lac Killarney, avec des grèves à Pine Falls, chez Manitoba Hydro, des problèmes avec Greyhound et catastrophe potentielle de Devils Lake.
Pourquoi le Premier ministre quitte-t-il le Manitoba à un tel moment?
Translation
I ask the Premier (Mr. Doer) why he is leaving the province with so many problems. Why is the Premier leaving Manitoba when there are such serious issues related to H1N1 influenza, farmers of the Interlake region and the Red River, pork producers, with our lakes like Lake Winnipeg, Lake Killarney, with strikes in Pine Falls, at Manitoba Hydro, problems with Greyhound and potential Devils Lake disaster.
Why is the Premier leaving the province at such a time?
Mr. Doer: Merci beaucoup [Thank you very much], Mr. Speaker. The member is inconsistent en français et en anglais [in French and in English]. Pas de problèmes pour le membre [Not a problem for the member] to have two different positions.
He is the only one I know that could have a position to hurry up the floodway in the city of Winnipeg and then the next minute go to Selkirk and say he's opposed to the floodway.
In French or in English, we would like to thank him for his long years of service as Leader of the Liberal Party and we wish him to stay as long as he would like, Mr. Speaker.
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Flood Mitigation (Selkirk)
Government Strategy
Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): At least Liberals can adapt to the times instead of running away to Washington. Mr. Premier–Mr. Speaker, the Premier's leaving Manitobans with lots of unresolved problems. And one of these, as people in the gallery today can attest to, is that he's leaving people north of Selkirk, in the front lines, ready and unfortunately vulnerable to a flood next year. Clay is available now, but the Premier is playing Ping-Pong with the federal government in terms of the dikes. You know, the Prime Minister's Minister of Water Stewardship told people yesterday–talked to James Bezan. James Bezan, the Member of Parliament, says he's ready to talk and meet with the minister. But why do people who live north of the floodway, who are vulnerable, have to negotiate back and forth between the federal government and the provincial government?
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Speaker: Order. Order.
Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, notwithstanding the fact that the time of his inconsistency was different, he's right, they did adapt with the time. One announcement was at 10 o'clock and one was at 10:30, two different positions.
I would point out that we went out and bought Amphibexes north of the city of Winnipeg. The federal Liberal government told us to go out and do it, and then, when the bill, came they went to the bathroom. So we like to negotiate agreements with federal and provincial governments on behalf of the victims of flooding and we are doing that, and we are committed to doing that.
Thirdly, Mr. Speaker, I also want to point out an inconsistency. At one point, he wrote a letter congratulating Mark Chipman for building the new MTS Centre, and then he marched with people with yellow ribbons around the Eaton's building and voted against it in this House. You know, you can't have at 10 o'clock in the morning one position and 10:30 have a different position, and finally the public will catch up to you. But I wish you all the best, sir. I wish you all the best in your inconsistent consistent positions.
City of Winnipeg Road Renewal Budget
Funding Increase
Hon. Bill Blaikie (Elmwood): Mr. Speaker–
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Speaker: Order. Order. Order. Order. Order. Order. Let's have some respect for the rules in the House. There's a rule in our book that states when a Speaker is standing that all members should be seated and the Speaker should be heard in silence. Let's have some co-operation here.
Mr. Blaikie: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I apologize for any fuss I may have caused by standing.
My question is for the honourable the First Minister, sometimes also known as the MLA for Concordia, and my colleague for the last 23 years in the broad politically sunlit uplands of northeast Winnipeg. And I wonder if the Premier would care to comment on the announcement yesterday of such great news for the people of northeast Winnipeg. And, while he's at it, Mr. Speaker, I wonder if he'd also care to comment on the–on the increase in provincial contributions to the annual residential and regional street funding for the City of Winnipeg. It seems to me that these matters would be of great interest to the Legislature and to the people of Manitoba.
Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Well, I want to thank the member for that surprise question and, dare I say this, the best question I had in the whole session in September. Thank you very much for that.
I want to thank him for his role and the other members of northeast Winnipeg, on all sides of the House, for the constructive advice about the Disraeli Bridge. We are absolutely delighted that the funding–the City of Winnipeg–I think we funded 18 percent of $16 million in the year 2000. With this announcement, the 2010 roads budget for the City of Winnipeg, paid by the Province of Manitoba, will be $38.1 million or 47 percent of that budget. That will allow us to do the Disraeli Bridge, and for those people who are worried about other maintenance of potholes–and I look around the Chamber; I might see some people–that will still leave $32 million for other maintenance in the city of Winnipeg. It's not perfect, but it's certainly–47 percent of the City budget, is certainly, we believe, a constructive investment in the good work the City's performing.
And I might point out the gas tax from the federal government is also very useful. In other words, when three parties are pulling together, we can slowly deal with the deficit on infrastructure in all our communities, including in the beautiful part of this province of northeast Winnipeg.
Thank you very much. Thank you.
Mr. Speaker: The honourable Member for Ste. Rose. [interjection] Time's up?
[Applause]
Time had expired for oral questions.
Mr. Rob Altemeyer (Wolseley): Late this summer I had the pleasure to attend the opening of a new park in Armstrong's Point, an important part of the Wolseley constituency, and one of Winnipeg's oldest heritage neighbourhoods.
Work on the new East Blanchard Park has actually been under way for almost a quarter of a century, but after much legwork and community effort, the Armstrong's Point Residents Association was finally able to unveil their new green space during its annual picnic on a lovely Wednesday afternoon. Almost 100 people gathered to witness the ribbon cutting, enjoy the outdoors and feast on the wonderful barbecue organized by the residents association. The true star of the afternoon was unquestionably East Blanchard Park itself.
As a Wolseley resident, I know full well how important green space is and how rare it can be in our core area. East Blanchard features a number of wonderful new features, including river access, new picnic benches and a river path.
Ms. Marilyn Brick, Acting Speaker, in the Chair
I'm also very pleased to officially recognize here, in the Manitoba Legislature, the residents of Armstrong's Point on this important addition to their neighbourhood. Armstrong's Point is home to some of Winnipeg's most celebrated heritage houses. I was able to learn more about this through a wonderful book entitled Armstrong's Point: A History, which was kindly given to me by Christine Common-Singh and written by North End resident and architectural historian, Randy Rostecki. I received this book on behalf of the Province of Manitoba, in recognition of our support of the establishment of East Blanchard Park, and Councillor Jenny Gerbasi received the same in recognition of the City's wonderful efforts on this front.
East Blanchard Park is the newest corner in this fascinating neighbourhood, where I'm sure there will be many more fantastic stories to come in the years ahead. Thank you very much.
Mr. Ralph Eichler (Lakeside): It's a pleasure for me to recognize Hitch'n Post country barbeque for celebrating their 25th year of business. Hitch'n Post is a landmark establishment of our community that, for many years, has provided quality service and product. It offers catering needs with an old western flair. It was the winner of the 2007 Interlake Tourism Association Partnership Award.
On September the 19th, Hitch'n Post celebrated this important anniversary with approximately 200 guests at a gala event. The gala dinner was ushered by the founder of the Hitch'n Post, Ed "T-Bone" Anderson. To follow tradition, Mr. Anderson rang his triangle to mark the beginning of the dinner. The entertainment for the evening was provided by Canadian Country Music Association award nominee Victoria Banks and the Danny Kramer Event Band.
Ed Anderson started the Hitch'n Post business in 1984, but since it's been there, many improvements to the family-run business operation. Hitch'n Post has made additions to this facility because of their growing popularity, and they now offer off-site catering. Even though Ed Anderson is no longer running the Hitch'n Post, the business remains in the family and is now operated by his son Kyle Anderson.
One of the benefits the Hitch'n Post site offers is that there is fresh air, open spaces, country hospitality. The site is located just 25 minutes from downtown Winnipeg, five minutes north of the Perimeter on Highway 101. Hitch'n Post offers a wonderful facility, with many impressive artifacts on the walls of their building. As for meals, Hitch'n Post offers delicious country cooking, including barbecue beef, baked beans, coleslaw and their specialty, apple crisp dessert.
Mr. Speaker, as MLA for Lakeside, I would like to congratulate Hitch'n Post barbeque on their recent 25th anniversary. Hitch'n Post has become a landmark in our community. I wish the business well in the next 25 years of operation.
Hon. Bill Blaikie (Elmwood): Madam Speaker, when I became the MLA for Elmwood on March the 24th of this year, I committed myself to solving a problem that was highlighted during the by-election, namely, the unacceptability of the plan to close the Disraeli Bridge for 16 months during its planned repairs.
To this end I met with Winnipeg Mayor Sam Katz shortly after the by-election in an effort to start a process that might lead to a solution, and I commend the mayor for being willing to meet with me at that time. Yesterday, I'm pleased to say, this process succeeded when the Premier (Mr. Doer), Mayor Sam Katz and I gathered for a press conference under the Disraeli Bridge to announce that the provincial government would be contributing $53.3 million to the project in order to ensure that the bridge will be repaired in such a way as to keep it open while it is being fixed. This has been the case with other bridges in Winnipeg and, in our view, the citizens of northeast Winnipeg deserve the same treatment.
* (14:30)
The provincial funding will enable thousands of drivers to continue using the bridge with minimal disruption. It also means a better bridge than would otherwise have been the case as the provincial funding was contingent on designing a bridge that would last for 75 years, and regardless of which engineering proposal the City ultimately opts for, the new freeway will provide for dedicated and protected walking and cycling lanes. We await the final details of what the Disraeli Bridge of the future will look like, but yesterday was a good day for northeast Winnipeg, and I'm glad to have played a part in making it happen.
Congratulations to all who, in their own way, contributed to highlighting the problem and creating the context in which it was possible to bring the City and Province together to do what was needed to be done, and congratulations in particular to our Premier (Mr. Doer), the MLA for Concordia, who saw to it that, as one of his last acts of Premier, he made sure that his constituents and mine and the constituents of Transcona and Radisson and Rossmere and River East were not abandoned to the original, unacceptable plan for closing the bridge.
Mr. David Faurschou (Portage la Prairie): I rise today to celebrate the centennial anniversary of the 19th Portage Royal Canadian Army Cadet Corps. Established in December 1909, the cadet corps is the oldest continuously active cadet corps in western Canada.
Mr. Speaker in the Chair
Under the leadership of Captain Terry Henry and the dedication of long-term volunteers such as Supply Officer Gloria Hooper, cadets develop leadership skills and a sense of active citizenship. Since 1997, both Captain Henry and Supply Officer Hooper have generated interests in the Canadian Armed Forces and equipped youth of Portage la Prairie with the necessary skills to contribute to society and become tomorrow's leaders.
Mr. Speaker, while the numbers vary from year to year, the cadet corps has always been an active and integral part of Portage la Prairie's community and youth activities. On October 3rd, the 33 members of the 19th Portage Royal Canadian Army Cadet Corps, joined by the 25th Crusaders Sea Cadet Corps of Winnipeg, marched in the streets of Portage la Prairie after being given Freedom of the City through proclamation presented to the corps by His Worship Mayor Ken Brennan.
While the cadet corps gets a portion of its funding from the military, the cadets are involved in many community fundraiser initiatives. Its community fundraising efforts, spearheaded by its dedicated support committee, goes towards field trips, summer camps and supporting the corps' band program.
On December 20th, 1909, the corps was officially incorporated. One hundred years later to the day, on December 20th, 2009, the young men and women of the cadet corps will gather to celebrate and honour members past and present and all who have participated over the last century in this proud tradition.
Mr. Speaker, I would like, on behalf of all members of the Assembly, to proudly congratulate the 19th Portage Royal Canadian Army Cadet Corps for achieving this landmark anniversary. Thank you.
Hon. Christine Melnick (Minister of Water Stewardship): The history of any community in part is also the history of certain remarkable families. Accordingly, the tapestry of Manitoba's past is enlivened by the vibrant thread of the Mager family's heritage, and I welcome the members of the family here today.
This summer in St. Norbert, a celebration of this family was held 150 years after they settled in the Red River Valley. French immigrants, Jean and Marie [phonetic] Mager arrived at the Red River Settlement on July 25, 1859. In tow were their five children and a grandchild named Victor. For the next decade, Jean and Marie [phonetic] ran St. Boniface's first food and beverage establishment.
After the death of Marie [phonetic], Jean donated his home and a portion of his riverbank property to the Grey Nuns who promptly established western Canada's first hospital, today known as St. Boniface Hospital. Before his death in 1871, the Mager patriarch proceeded to establish a brewery, Winnipeg's first, and a successful saw and grist mill.
Various descendants of Jean and Marie [phonetic] Mager have left their imprint on our province's history through perhaps–but perhaps none so distinctively as the couple's aforementioned grandchild. Attending Collège de Saint-Boniface, Victor became a leading member of the nascent business community, soon acquiring more than a hundred acres of land in what is now north St. Vital. With the help for his first wife, Elizabeth and their nine children, Victor became a renowned market gardener. Before his death in 1930, Victor became the first reeve of the R.M. of St. Boniface, encompassing what we now know as St. Vital. He also helped to build his neighbourhood's first school and served as a trustee for 30 years.
The descendants of these early Mager family members continue to be dynamic members of their communities, and this summer, 150 years to the day after Jean, Marie [phonetic] and Victor arrived in the Red River Valley, I was honoured to attend a wonderful family reunion of friends and family in the St. Norbert Provincial Park. It is proof, Mr. Speaker, that this family enlivens our province today as surely as their ancestors have in our past. Thank you.
Mr. Speaker: Order, please. Because the House will be adjourning today, I'm asking that all honourable members remove the contents of their desks in the Chamber. I encourage members to recycle as much of the material as possible. I remind honourable members that the blue bins here in the Chamber are designated for recycling of Hansard only. Any other material you'd like to recycle may be placed in the larger recycling containers in the message rooms located just outside the Chamber. I thank you for your participation.
House Business
Hon. Dave Chomiak (Government House Leader): Mr. Speaker, just prior to orders of the day, I wonder if you'd canvass the House to see if there's leave to extend reporting deadline for the Special Committee on Senate Reform.
Mr. Speaker: Is there leave to extend the reporting deadline for the Special Committee on Senate Reform. Is there leave? [Agreed]
Mr. Chomiak: Mr. Speaker, just prior to–just prior to discussing orders of the day, I just wanna quickly acknowledge and thank all members of the House for all of their diligent and hard work, and I wanna particularly thank the Opposition House Leader (Mr. Hawranik) and the Liberal Party, third party House Leader. I don't think I've had a more working, a more appropriate, and honourable and constructive working relationship on virtually anything I've done in my life, and I wanna thank them and their caucuses for a classic example of what happens when people can work together to improve and to try to–try to make things work. It's been absolutely incredible. And I won't even get into my regards for the member that sits beside me who will be speaking later this day.
House business, Mr. Speaker, this afternoon, we'd like to call for concurrence and third reading of Bill 4. I'd also–I'd also like to ask if there will be leave for the member from River Heights because he's spoken on Bill 4, if there's leave of the House to allow him to speak on Bill 4 again.
Mr. Speaker: [inaudible] deal with concurrence and third reading of Bill No. 4, The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act, and also that the member for River Heights (Mr. Gerrard) has already spoken, but is there leave for the honourable member to speak again to the bill? [Agreed]
Mr. Chomiak: I'd also like to indicate, Mr. Speaker, that I think there's an agreement of the–well, there is an agreement of the House, and either I or the Acting Opposition House Leader will be asking–be asking yourself to, at some point, to take a short recess and then a return at the call of the Chair, but that will happen sometime after we have commenced debate on Bill 4.
Mr. Speaker: Okay, we'll do that when the time comes.
Bill 4–The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act
Mr. Speaker: So now I'm going to call concurrence and third reading of Bill No. 4, The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act, standing in the name of the honourable member for Arthur Virden who has 25 minutes remaining.
Mr. Larry Maguire (Arthur-Virden): It was my pleasure yesterday to rise in the House to speak to the third reading of The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act, Bill 4, and its present form, Mr. Speaker, and, of course, this came in the previous session as Bill 46.
Mr. Speaker, I was referring yesterday to the folks in the R.M. of Rosser in regards to their concern over this government's inability to be good stewards of the region in regards to farmland, and of course, then I guess I should refer that to their concern was not with this government. It was with the City of Winnipeg in it's taking over a part of that land, and I want to reiterate that none of the folks at the public meeting have indicated from Rosser that they are against the setting up of CentrePort.
Ms. Marilyn Brick, Acting Speaker, in the Chair
It's like my comments about Bill 31. We're not against the road going up the east side of Lake Winnipeg, but we have concerns with how the government wants to get the road built.
* (14:40)
And so, I think that the folks in Rosser have a concern. They don't want to give up all of the land that they have had there. It'll be a big chunk of their municipality, and there's an offer on the table that they need to look at very seriously. But I think it's a–it is a pretty major concern because when I was talking about tax increment financing the other day, there is a term to tax increment financing that, once the 20- or 25- or 30-year period is up, whereby the investment is supposed to capture all of the incremental increases in education taxes from that area, those taxes then would revert back to the municipality in that region where they were to be collected and then would be available for that particular school division.
Well, Mr. Speaker, that's not gonna happen in the case of Rosser if this land is turned over to the City. They won't get the opportunity to get those dollars back from the huge increase or large increase that may be there in the tax increment financing program the way it's announced, those dollars will, therefore, revert over to the City of Winnipeg, because they would be the ones that would own this land. They would be the ones that would do the development of it, and have an opportunity to, perhaps, use those dollars.
The dollars will be the same, Madam Deputy Speaker, but they'll just go to a different entity, and I think that's a concern of the people in Rosser because they know that that's the city, and as Manitoba grows and moves northwest further out in the rural area with the Perimeter Highway running through that region, there is potential with this project and others for a, not only an economic industrial growth in their area, but with that comes the–in most of the other foreign trade zone areas and developments that I've seen of this nature in the studies that I've had in looking at some of them, the ones that have been most successful in the U.S. there is, of course, a residential component required to these areas as well, and Rosser is well suited to take advantage of some of those areas. It's just that to be hit with the types of millions of dollars that would be required to establish sewer and water and roads in this particular region would be a big drain on their finances, and probably, as they've said, an inability because of the smaller size and population of the region to be able to fund that sort of thing presently in their R.M.
So, Madam Deputy Speaker, I, too, want to add a couple of words in regards to the leaving of the Premier (Mr. Doer), the member from Concordia, today as well. As I may not have another chance to speak to other bills in the House today. I'd just like to commend the Premier for his 23 years. I think I could probably present him with some horoscope numbers or some numbers that he could buy a lottery ticket with today, and that would be 23 years in the House, 23 years as an MLA, 21 years as the Leader of the NDP in the province of Manitoba, 11 years in opposition, 10 years just passed last week as the leader–as the Premier of the Province, and at age–well, he doesn't want to have ages announced in the House, but it was in the paper that he's 61, and if he doesn't like that number, well, today is the 8th of October, he could use the number eight. And I would say that I would just like to, on behalf of the constituents of Arthur-Virden, provide a fond farewell, I guess, to the Premier and wish him well in all of his endeavours in regards to, not just Manitoba, but all of the provinces in Canada as Ambassador to the United States and have that opportunity to be able to represent all of us as constituents in Manitoba in Washington with our neighbours and dealing with issues like the country of origin labelling.
And, as well, you know, on the agricultural side, but also on the industrial side here dealing and keeping in the forefront of his mind the issue of CentrePort, because I know that is–from speaking to American neighbours and here–that it is a big issue to be able to have trade with our American neighbours. Thirty-seven of 50 U.S. states are–Canada is the largest trading partner. We have a major corridor running from Winnipeg to Mexico, and I wanted to have the opportunity to be able to wish him well and always remember that corridor in his mind of the roads that lead out of Manitoba as well as into Manitoba and the types of trade that could be possible. And there are opportunities in CentrePort, we just do not feel that the bill that the government has brought forward in Bill 4 is a responsible bill to bring forward in regards to the way to fund this program.
Particularly, Madam Deputy Speaker, when there are opportunities in government-backed programs to establish support for those particular types of business entities that've traditionally done well and expanded in Manitoba because of the direct involvement and responsibility of government, and I do not–you know, I know that there are other partnerships involved, whether they're private-public partnerships, and I know some of the members of the NDP don't like to hear that terminology even though it's being used across the country and brought in nationally now in what's called a 3P bill.
And I think there are great opportunities to expand on the development of not only our rail services, our highway services and, particularly, I do not want to leave out our Winnipeg Airports Authority and the development and expansion of the airport that we have, a wonderful opportunity with our central location around the globe here in Manitoba and in the city of Winnipeg. And, if we are successful in the development of this project, then all Manitobans will be successful and have a great opportunity for thousands of more jobs.
I'm proud to have had the opportunity to help get the bill through, the CentrePort bill through last fall, and I'm very proud to have put forth the foreign trade zone private members' resolution that passed on the 17th of September. I appreciate the unanimous support of the members of the House in that area, as I appreciated working with the government to get that bill through last fall.
And I know that there's opportunities. I know that if we–if we–if we can have a government in Manitoba that will bring forward solid tax programming, look at the removal of the tax from this particular trade zone until either warehousing projects, manufacturing or processing facilities add value to these particular entities or projects, Madam Chair and–Madam Deputy Speaker, and be able to not tax them until they leave that zone, will be a great plus for our children and the future generations of Manitobans that will continue to develop this province in a fine manner.
I know, Madam Deputy Speaker, that I speak for many people in the House when I say that I know that this bill could be used, if it was used right, to fund some of these areas, but nothing in the bill refers to CentrePort, even though each minister and member of the government that has gotten up to speak always refers to CentrePort being used in this particular bill.
And so, I think that with those few words, Madam Chair, I'd just like to–I'd just like to say that I, in closing, again wish the Premier (Mr. Doer) well and want to wish him all of the best in Washington as he becomes the Ambassador to the United States from Canada.
Mr. Speaker in the Chair
But, in closing, I want to say that I do not think that Bill 4 is the proper way to fund the projects. I don't think it's right to take dollars from education, dollars from children and put them into development in this particular manner. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Leonard Derkach (Russell): Mr. Speaker, for me, this is a bit of a historic moment, as it is for a few colleagues in this House because the Premier and the member from River East and I came into the House at the same time back in 1986.
And so, although I know you're gonna caution me about relevance today, Mr. Speaker, I have to say, at the outset, that this is not a piece of legislation that I can lend my support to, and one that, I think, a lot has been said about, and we will be, indeed, voting against this, because I think the principle is wrong. And the principle of the bill does not take into account that taxes collected for education should go to our children, rather than to infrastructure and construction and buildings.
But, Mr. Speaker, having said that on the bill, I want to turn my attention to a man who I came into this House with, and although we were on opposite sides of the fence, there were days, in the past, when both the Premier and I had some very pointed and fairly aggressive debates.
And, Mr. Speaker, what was encouraging about all of that is that it inspired one to get up and to either refute what had been put on the record by the now-Premier or, perhaps, a healthy debate on different views and different philosophies.
But, Mr. Speaker, in this Legislature, that is something that is offered as a–as a–as a symbol of democracy, I think, and something that we need to adhere to very, very dearly.
Mr. Speaker, the Premier, when he came into this House, he came in under the Pawley administration and quickly assumed a Cabinet position as Minister of Urban Affairs, and I think he was Minister of Crown Corporations at the time as well, something that I was the critic for. So we did have some healthy debates in those days,
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But what I recognized, from the very beginning was that this was an individual who enjoyed the House, he enjoyed a healthy debate, and someone who was passionate about his beliefs, and somebody who was passionate about the people that he represented in terms of representing their views in the Legislature.
And that's something, Mr. Speaker, that I think all of us have to respect. When you stand up for the people who have brought you here, when you talk about them in a way that is meaningful and you really have their interests at heart, that shows that you, indeed, have been sent here with the right intentions and with the right motives. And that is something that I respected about the Premier (Mr. Doer) and something that I will always respect him as an individual in that respect.
But, Mr. Speaker, through our time here in the House, we did differ on philosophies fairly significantly. And I know he sat in opposition for some 12 years as Leader of the Opposition while we were in government. And during all those times, he attacked us from many fronts and that's the job of the Leader of the Official Opposition. But he forgot that when he became the Premier, that that was suppose to be set aside, and he continued to attack us. As a matter of fact, even to this very day, when he got up in the House, he still went back to the '90s. He could not refrain from that role of being a critic of a government during the '90s that became very successful and very popular with Manitobans.
But, Mr. Speaker, as he leaves and joins the diplomatic corps in Ottawa, I have to wish him well and, indeed, I think all Manitobans want to wish him well. He has done his job in Manitoba over the 23 years, almost 24 years that he has represented this province and represented his constituency. I think he can leave this province with his head held high knowing that he has done and has fulfilled his mandate, not only as an MLA, but as a minister and a Premier.
And so, Mr. Speaker, there is a time in the House when we have to acknowledge the contributions that we make as members to this Legislature and, today, as someone who came in with the Premier, I want to fully acknowledge the fact that, indeed, he is someone that I do have respect for. He is a person that I know has put his heart into giving Manitobans his very best and, although our philosophies differed, I think he has measured up to the task and indeed, as someone that this province will record in history as a person who did his job very well as a representative for the people of our province.
And so, Mr. Speaker, with those few words, I want to conclude my remarks and just say to the Premier (Mr. Doer) that we really, really wish him well in representing Canada at the embassy in Washington. Thank you very much.
House Business
Mr. Kelvin Goertzen (Deputy Official Opposition House Leader): On House business.
Mr. Speaker: On House business.
Mr. Goertzen: I ask, Mr. Speaker, if you could seek if there's leave of the House to now recess the House and have it convened at the call of the Speaker, that prior to it being convened, that you ring the division bells for five minutes.
Mr. Speaker: Okay, so is there leave of the House for the House to recess and to reconvene at the call of the Speaker and that the bells will ring for five minutes before we commence the business of the House? Is there agreement? [Agreed]
The House recessed at 2:54 p.m.
___________
The House resumed at 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker: Please be seated. Order.
House Business
Hon. Dave Chomiak (Government House Leader): Mr. Speaker, I wonder if you might canvass the House to see if there's leave to waive rule 4(6), requiring 10 days' notice of intersessional committee meetings with regard to the Special Committee on Senate Reform.
Mr. Speaker: Is there leave to waive rule 4(6) requiring 10 days' notice of intersessional committee meetings with regard to the Special Committee on Senate Reform. Is there leave? [Agreed]
Mr. Chomiak: I just want to clarify that that's the special committee of the House that we're referencing, and I just want to inform the House that in some point in the afternoon we may break into a spontaneous rendition of a traditional Ukrainian song of salute. You may note that during the course of proceedings, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.
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Mr. Speaker: Okay. As previously agreed, the time is now past 10 after three. We will now continue and we will resume debate on concurrence and third reading of Bill No. 4, The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act.
Hon. Jon Gerrard (River Heights): Mr. Speaker, as this session winds down, I want to say a few words, not only on the economic circumstances, but in the way of a goodbye to the Premier (Mr. Doer) who will be leaving shortly to go to Washington.
My task in doing this is threefold. You know, first to recognize that the Premier, in achieving three majority governments, has been a formidable force in politics in Manitoba. Second, I need to remind the Premier that the legacy he leaves behind is it's one that's been plenty of scandals and long on shortcomings. Third, I will give the Premier this send-off and remind him to pay attention to some important issues in Manitoba.
So, first, let me congratulate the Premier on his persistence and his electoral success in the last three provincial elections. I know that it didn't come easily. The Premier lost three elections before he succeeded in winning three and, of course, persistence is an important trait for a politician. I'm trying to learn from the Premier in moving on from three losing elections to three winning ones.
Now part of the Premier's success, as we all know, was that he was good at fooling people. He successfully pretended to be a Liberal, and, of course, that made my life kind of difficult because the Premier, after all, is a pretty good actor. And the Premier, to his credit, you know, like a Don Juan or a Don Quixote, has kind of seduced Manitobans into thinking that he's a wonderful person.
Early on, I know that the Premier decided that the way to win an election was to hug a Liberal. He said it himself. He's told me this. You know, fortunately for me, Liberals are increasingly tired of being squeezed by the Premier and his NDP confederates.
Now I'm going to move on to talk a little bit about the Premier's legacy, my second task. You know, as we all know, the Premier has a legacy of scandals and problems. You know, the Hydra House scandal, the Aiyawin scandal, the Crocus scandal, I could go on and on. You know, but give it–give it to the Premier to mess up when dealing with children and adults with disabilities, in dealing with Aboriginal people and their housing, and in dealing with the money of many workers and solid Manitobans who'd invested, in good faith, for their retirement years.
You know, there's also a legacy of lots of spending without really getting results. The budget for health care and Justice have increased dramatically under the Premier's watch and yet, for that, the problems in health care and in crime in Manitoba have, you know, exploded or, at best, not got any better. You know, it's been good public relations to show that you're scattering dollars here and there on problems. But when wait lists for MRIs have ballooned to 19 weeks, almost half a year for an essential diagnostic service, even the best spin doctors will tell you that it's kind of a tough one to spin well. But our Premier, I acknowledge, gave it a great shot, and maybe he should look at starting to teach a course to spin doctors. They might need that in Washington.
The Premier's plan–the Premier's plan for fooling the public when dealing with wait lists for hip and knee surgery first let the situation deteriorate badly so that wait lists for hip and replacement surgery, which were 14 or 15 weeks in '99-2000 when the Premier came to office, had reached ominous waits of 29 to 32 weeks by 2003. And after pouring lots of money at the issue, the Premier has got the wait lists back to where they were when he came to office: 14 to 15 weeks. You know, I guess one could say, maybe, the Premier did such a bad job to start with so that he could now make the kind of misleading claim that he's responsible for reducing wait times from the terrible 28 to 32 weeks that they'd reached under his watch, now down to back where they were when he was first elected. And, of course, the award for spin doctoring goes, once again, to the Premier.
The Premier's employed a similar strategy, of course, when dealing with crime. When it comes to auto thefts, he let the number rise to astronomical proportions. You know, it's a strategy that's worked because, when they were under astronomical proportions, he's now able to say, oh, we've reduced these and we're solving it even though the numbers are about where they were when the Premier first came to office.
And we saw the same kind of thing–approach to infrastructure. You know, the early years of the Premier were marked by problems. By 2005, the bridges were deteriorating. A major bridge on the Trans-Canada Highway had to be closed for years for a repair. It was so bad that Dominion City, two bridges were down and the community was virtually cut off from the rest of Manitoba. Highway 2 from Winnipeg to Elm Creek was like a moonscape. And, finally, Premier, like Don Quixote, he jumped on his horse and claimed he was saving the people of Manitoba from the situation he'd created, finally making the investments in infrastructure that Liberals had been pushing for, for a long time.
And, of course, I'm following the Premier's long to be a Liberal. The Premier has followed Liberals' lead, although often with half measures. I remember, you know, Liberals worked with Denis Rocan to end smoking indoors in Manitoba and, all the while, up to the very last minute, the Premier was saying, no, I don't want to do that. Liberals put forward legislation to remove phosphorus from automatic dishwasher detergent. And after the NDP had said it's only a dishwasher bill, the Premier changed his mind and supported removing phosphorus from household dishwasher detergents.
We could talk about many other areas where the Premier has, you know, spoken: diabetes, FASD. But the fact is that the diabetes incidence is going up, the FASD incidence is still far too high.
On patient safety, the Premier followed the Liberal lead in endorsing the Liberal Apology Act, for which Manitobans are thankful, in reducing time people have to wait to see their own medical record, in enabling patients and families to report medical errors.
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The Premier (Mr. Doer), in his speech, should put in a thank you to the Liberals, for without us much less would have been accomplished. I should add, I hope the Premier will at least finally proclaim The Personal Health Information Act before he leaves.
And the Premier's legacy when it comes to finance will be consistent with other aspects, a sleight of hand, cover up, misleading Manitobans. Premier promised Manitobans to have a balanced budget and, as he leaves, he says goodbye with a planned deficit of $88 million in the core operating account. The Premier will claim he's balanced budget but only because he changed the law and could make the claim that a deficit is a balanced budget.
And the Premier's been good at taking items off the book. Most of the dollars spent on infrastructure now are put in future years instead of the year they're spent. You know, the–we admire the Premier for his sleight of hand but, you know, don't ever go to a casino and try to play cards with him with–Lord knows, in Washington as well.
Those who are retired teachers know this too well that teachers came to the table to support the Premier to begin with but have found his promises and commitments empty, and are now in retirement are living with far less income and far less of a COLA than they had been to led to believe that they would have.
And in this last session of the Legislature, under the Premier, instead of smooth sailing, we've had more emergency debates on matters of urgent public importance than ever before in the history of the Legislature. There are big challenges resulting perhaps, in part, from circumstances, but in part from poor management by the Premier. It's no wonder the Premier said that, you know, well, I'm getting out while the getting is good. There is lots more. We talked about them in H1N1, in agriculture, in Lake Winnipeg and others, the environment, Killarney Lake, so on.
You know, I think that the Premier–the Premier will talk about the wonderful things but it's sometimes up to us to provide a little bit of a balance, and we'll do that now and in the future. We admire and watch the Premier and respect him for his political instincts. We respect the Premier as a political foe. We hope that the Premier will do well in Washington, but we also know that we have more children in foster care than at the start of the Premier's term and more children and parents visiting Winnipeg Harvest than ever before.
The Premier (Mr. Doer) is off. We wish the Premier well in Washington. We know he's off, like Don Quixote to woo some Washington players and work for all of us. Mr. Premier, when you reach for that glass of champagne and hobnob with world leaders, don't forget the people of Manitoba. Don't forget those who are visiting the food banks. When you golf the lush golf courses, don't forget the flood victims north of Selkirk and the dying lakes, and when you're eating and dancing in some fancy soiree, don't forget that Manitoba is the centre of North America. It's a wonderful place.
We wish you well in Washington. Remember us. We'll remember you. Thank you.
Mr. Hugh McFadyen (Leader of the Official Opposition): That will be a hard act to follow. Mr. Speaker, I want to take just a few minutes to put some comments on the record. There'll be lots of time for people considerably less partisan than myself and others in the House to debate legacy and other issues of the last 10 years.
I want to take this opportunity today just to reflect on a few of the–a few of the high points in my interactions with the Premier (Mr. Doer) since I first met him 19 years ago, and I think he recalls this day well. In the course of the 1990 provincial election campaign that Premier Filmon had called in the aftermath of much of the national wrangling over Meech Lake, I was working as a young volunteer for a candidate in Assiniboia in 1990, and the Premier was there as Leader of the Opposition at a campaign event at Assiniboia Park–at Assiniboine Park, and there was a football that somebody had at the event. And so I picked it up and I threw it to the Premier as best I could. Mitch Zalnasky had been my football coach, somebody the Premier and I both know well. I threw the ball to the Premier, and he did the exact opposite of Bob Stanfield; he caught it absolutely perfectly and he zipped it right back at me, and I was able to catch the ball. And we zipped it back and forth and all the cameras came out and snapped these photographs, fabulous photographs of the Premier throwing and catching a football. Mr. Speaker, in that small way, I think I may have inadvertently contributed to some of the political success that he's had in the years since then because they were great photographs.
And I do want to say he was much more adept at handling the football in Assiniboine Park than I was with a soccer ball in St. Vital Park just about two years ago. And I'm grateful to the photo editors at some of the newspapers that they didn't run the least flattering photograph that I know that they have in their archives and which will, I assume, appear at some point. But I'm grateful for that.
And so that was my first encounter with the Premier. I'd met him on a number of other occasions as Leader of the Opposition, in social settings and other settings and always enjoyed his company and good humour.
Mr. Speaker, we had a little back and forth yesterday about the game of golf. The Premier commonly refers to the fact that he's in the back nine of life, and I just want to say, for the record, because I didn't get the opportunity yesterday, that anybody who's golfed with me will know, that I am, at best, a mediocre golfer and that the 19th hole has always been where I have excelled. And I don't want to leave any doubt about my comments yesterday.
One of the things that I think most of us will recall about the Premier is just his way with words: putting the puck in the net, which frankly, he did more often than not, particularly politically, and his other analogies, his other great sports analogies. When he has been at his best, he has been humorous and enjoyable. We have licked our wounds from time to time with some of the blistering comebacks that he has given to us here in the House, and to carry on with the sports analogies, I will never forget my first time standing in the House as Leader of the Opposition putting questions to him and the fact that my knees were quivering and I felt like the guy going into the ring with Max Baer, just getting ready to have an absolute licking laid on me. And, sure enough, I wasn't disappointed, Mr. Speaker, and I've stood up on this side of the House and been on the receiving end of many more since then as well.
But I just want to leave aside comments about policy issues and decisions that we've had disagreements with and also focus on some of the–take the opportunity to focus on some of the areas where we've worked together, I think, quite well.
One of the recent examples was the request of the Prime Minister for the Premier (Mr. Doer) and I to make recommendations with respect to the appointment of the new Lieutenant-Governor of Manitoba. At the time, we agreed that this is not something we should advertise widely, the fact that we have been consulted on this. In fact, in his characteristically good-natured way, the Premier likened it to be part of a baby judging contest; you just can't win. There were some great names that came forward and, in the end, we, I think, worked well together in putting forward recommendations and both feel, I think, some sense of satisfaction, much satisfaction at the fact that our first Chinese Canadian Lieutenant-Governor was appointed as a result of the work we did together on that file.
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Mr. Speaker, there have been other occasions the Premier has been at times generous and including opposition members on various significant issues. We had the opportunity to travel together in Ottawa with respect to criminal justice reform. He has included opposition members in discussions around pandemic planning and emergency preparedness for the province, which we have appreciated being part of and hopefully have been constructive in terms of our contributions.
Of all the list of things that the member for River Heights (Mr. Gerrard) just went through, I actually think that the low point for the Premier came in 2006 when he broke the Grey Cup after the Grey Cup game. That, Mr. Speaker, of anything else I think was the low point. But, as with any–as with any leader and as with any Premier, there will be–there will be successes and there will be–there will be failures and disappointments. And lots of people will form their own opinions about all of those–all of those things. What I will say is that we acknowledge that he has been successful in very many ways.
One of the discussions that we had privately some months ago was the fact that there are many really good people who serve in this House as members of Cabinet, members of the Legislature, a few people who have the privilege of being Leader of the Opposition, and fewer still who have both the privilege and the awesome responsibility of being Premier of Manitoba. And many, after leaving office, have not–in my view, certainly, and I think the view of many others–not been accorded the degree of personal respect that they deserve.
Setting aside partisanship entirely, there are incredible sacrifices involved with public service, and, in particular, as Premier of the Province when you have everybody looking to pick away at every decision, every action, every word, it is an incredibly challenging and stressful role to be in and, I think, as he has evolved in his life as Premier, has handled with a great deal of grace in most situations. Where he hasn't been graceful, we've certainly known about it, Mr. Speaker, but at his best, which we've seen a great deal of, he has been generous and graceful and good natured and those are the–those are the moments that, I think, all members of the House will reflect on and miss when he is no longer a part of the deliberations in this Chamber.
And so, Mr. Speaker, I was–I think, as any member of the House would have had a series of feelings and emotions after learning of the Premier's decision to resign and to accept the very significant role as Ambassador to the United States. The one of the things that I thought was really encouraging was the fact that somebody who is leaving office, notwithstanding our disagreements, was being given an opportunity to carry on and serve in a new capacity, and I think that there will be many people from different parties as we come to the next election who will make their own decisions. And what I would hope for, for all of them, is that they're accorded the respect that they deserve and the opportunities to carry on serving in capacities that they find personally satisfying as well as beneficial to our province and to our country.
So I want to just close by congratulating the Premier on his very significant appointment. Thank him for some of the opportunities and the advice and positive things that he's done for our province, and, in particular, for the personal sacrifices that have been made in order to serve in this very, very significant role. And there are sacrifices made by all members of Cabinet, but the Premier, in particular, is under the microscope 24 hours a day, seven days a week, and that is something that most people, I think, cannot even begin to comprehend, and so I thank you, sir, for what you have done.
I think every opposition leader learns something from the premier that they're up against. I've heard him make reference to lessons that he learned in opposition from Premier Filmon and so I think what we hope to do is take away those things that we have been–have thought were positive, and maybe change those things that maybe we think weren't positive. But, today, to focus on the positive to take away some of the positive lessons that he's–that he's taught about politics and leadership and congratulate him personally on this next tremendous responsibility that he will take on as Canada's Ambassador to Washington, wish him and his family and friends well in the coming days and weeks, and simply to say that we look forward to seeing him continue to excel in this new role on behalf of the people of Canada. Thank you.
Hon. Gary Doer (Premier): Mr. Speaker, certainly, I want to thank the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. McFadyen) for his comments. This is an adversarial place, but there is, also, a sense of place in politics and, certainly, I want to thank him very much for his comments.
I would point out I was leader of the third party, struggling third party, in 1990 when I encountered the young–I think he was working with Linda McIntosh at the time in the campaign, and I was a candidate just at a kind of all-party event, a charity event, but there was no charity from the new assistant to Linda McIntosh. He started throwing the football at me in front of a camera.
Now, I know the story of Robert Stanfield, and most Canadians don't. He caught the ball 19 times on the tarmac. I've even talked to the photographer that took the picture. It was the 20th time that he dropped the ball. So I want to thank the member for playing with me, not only one or two times with the football–I love football–but at 21 and 22 and 23 times, he was really working at it, and then he started throwing knuckle balls and high balls. I was looking back at the camera, and, you know, it was–what can I say?
And I've had some other opportunities like that, where I've almost blown election campaigns. Thank goodness there wasn't a photographer when I went–I kept going up to Swan River. You know, I heard this person, Rosann Wowchuk, was going to win in 1990. I knew it was tight. And the things that people don't see and, you know, the public doesn't see with all of us, the amount of hours we drive, the amount of hours we put in, the amount of hours where we're away from our family.
And I remember standing by the side of the road, I won't say in what capacity, at about two in the morning after a meeting in Swan River, driving back to Winnipeg, these beautiful northern lights were out there, but you just look up and say, why am I doing this? Is it going to make a difference, you know? And, obviously, the northern lights answered with Rosann Wowchuk being elected in that election, but a lot of times all of us go on behalf of great people that run and put their name on a ballot and are not successful.
And I think that that is something that really does make this place special for all of us, because it is hard to get here. There's people in, quote, seats that are, quote, safe, and I never believe that term should be used, but seats that are normally considered to be in one side of the aisle or the other, there's often very vigorous and, dare I say, competitive nomination races. Certainly, it's not a foregone conclusion for people to get nominations, and many people I know here had to fight very hard to get a nomination, and many people across the way I know, as well, who, you know, literally hundreds of people determining. So it is a real honour.
I think the most dangerous photo op I had, and I have to mention this. It was mentioned the other day by a photographer is–I got sucked in at chopping wood at–you know, I'm Paul Bunyan. I chop wood, I'm okay, you know. I'm a lumberjack; I'm okay, you know. But, normally, you know, we do have chain saws, but, no, not here. It was Cranberry Portage, and we were going–you know, I was asked by an elder to chop some wood.
I think Wayne commented on this, from the Free Press, said, it was the most stubborn damn piece of wood I ever saw in my life. It was wet; it was gnarly; it was–it was, you know you couldn't even get an axe on an edge, you know. And, I know one of the reporters just stood beside me, he said, so what could I say, you know? You know, if you chop your foot off, I gotta report on it, you know. We just gotta do that, you know. And, you know, eventually we did cut it.
But, boy, I've done some interesting things in my inability to say no to whether it's a football or a piece of wood or kayaking and racing with Governor Owens from Colorado up in Churchill, 'cause couldn't let Manitoba's side down, in the middle of the belugas, when two A personalities just sort of nudging in front of each other and all of a sudden they're going like crazy.
* (15:40)
And I also remember in Leaf Rapids, the same situation, when I was in a, quote, celebrity dog race, and Jay Cowan and I both went in and Elijah. Elijah wasn't peaking too early, but Jay Cowan and I, you know, we said–we said beforehand, oh, we're not going to embarrass each other. We'll just go out there for the five miles and have a nice little run in the snow. And so, soon or later, you know, I notice he's starting to pedal, so I start pedalling the toboggan, and he starts pushing harder. I start pushing harder. We were absolutely soaked by the end of the finish line. We were exhausted. I won't say who won, but I really did appreciate the trophy. Jay was a lot smarter than I was. He always passed the IQ test. We had a tremendous amount of enjoyment.
And I just want to say that I was elected in '86. Two other members, the member from River East and the member for Russell (Mr. Derkach) were part of our class, and there always is a kind of a, you know, kind of a funny relationship with–when people you are elected with. I'm sure the member from Elmwood felt this many, many times in Parliament. You become, you know, you become close in the sense of being elected at the same time. You become friends; you share stories; you talk about your family, and then you go out and try to beat the other person to a pulp in the next election campaign. I mean, that's the way it is in a competitive system, and it doesn't mean to say you're not friends, you're not colleagues, you don't respect each other, and that you have–and you know that the other individual cares a lot about this province and cares a lot about the future of this place.
I want to say, and I had a chance to say it on Oscar's–the condolence motion, but I just want to say to those people who don't live in the city of Winnipeg: the hours you put in on top of the hours that you put in as a member of the Legislature–the fact that you spend so many hours travelling not only to your constituency, but in your constituency, I think sometimes those of us, and I include the media, do not–living inside the Perimeter Highway–do not give enough credit for the tremendous hours and expectations people have. And so one of my suggestions is that when people are doing reports on how people vote, if they vote, consider when a person is in Manigotagan or in Poplar River or in Russell or in Churchill or other places. There is a different requirement.
And I know on our side and I know on the other side, we support each other. We want to have enough votes to win the legislative votes and challenges and rules, challenges and other procedure votes, but, you know, our office is here. It's in our–in our, in the building we work in. It's in our constituency office, and it's in our constituencies. Our office is not only defined as in this building, and that's why it's really important to support each other across all the party lines in the tougher jobs that people from northern and rural ridings have to represent. And I want to thank them for their hours of travel on behalf of all Manitobans–I really, really do.
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Mr. Doer: I am proud to have been elected to this Legislature, and I know the pride that Bill Blaikie felt after 29 years in Parliament. You know, it is–I think there's lots of people that have commented about democracy, question period. You know, some of the efforts you have to put in to getting some coverage of issues that are important to your own backers, your own supporters, to the public as a whole. But I also know that legislation–and we're talking about The Community Revitalization Act today, which I support, and I'm speaking to that bill. And I believe very strongly in this bill, but I do believe that there's lots of good work that goes on in legislation, and I always think we should try to listen to each other for suggestions on amendments.
I've always thought that private members bills should be supported, not this thing that we have all the ideas. I know after somebody says, you know, we stole an idea. I hear things from all the people of Manitoba; 1.2 million Manitobans have great ideas. Nobody in government, nobody in opposition has a lock on good ideas. I think you try to listen; you try to adapt; you try to adjust; you try to pay attention. And I just want to say the hours that people put in on legislation, again, doesn't get some of the same attention, but it is very, very important.
The laws we're passing this week are all very important for Manitobans, whether they're private members' bills, whether they're government bills, whether they're private members' bills that didn't proceed but are going to be studied in terms of the criminal justice system, they're all very important. And I know there's a partisan competitive part of this session and this Legislature, which I love. I love the competition. I mean, if you don't love it, you don't belong here. But there is also that constructive part that doesn't get as much media, doesn't get a lot of coverage. Sometimes, we ourselves are the worst enemies of the good work we each do, in our competitive roles, but I do believe the public should know that people are working extremely hard.
The committee work–I'm really pleased that all of you have worked hard to improve the Public Accounts Committee. I think this has been a great deal of success in terms of moving forward on a lot of these issues of financial transparency, and that crosses all party lines.
And I've often thought that we don't use enough all-party committees. One of the members talked about the smoking committee. It did great work; it did really good work. I brought in a private member's bill, you know, and one of the members of the media who I knew was a smoker said, don't worry, we'll get you on the front page tomorrow, and I–for banning smoking in day care centres. I did get lots of calls after that. It was really not that helpful, politically, but it was the right thing to do. It was in 1989. But the all-party committee did good work. The Healthy Living report did really good work. The work on Senate reform probably got a little bit of push this week on terms of getting a consensus on some of the ideas. Sometimes out of crisis comes an opportunity, as they say in an overused way.
I thought the work we did on the residential schools following the great work in Parliament on the apology on residential schools, and not just the apology and the statements that were made, led by the member for Rupertsland (Mr. Robinson), but the statements–we went beyond that–what do we do next for Aboriginal people, First Nations people. The speeches in this House should inform not only what was wrong in the past but what should be done in the future. And I think that that is–sometimes we do really good work.
We had an all-party committee on Shilo when the Germans pulled out, the German military, and it was good work. But we had to struggle because the 2PPCLI was going to be relocated into Alberta. Shilo was going to be closed down, and now we have a situation where not only do we have the troops going there, but we had all parties supporting that. That is what–how we should work on a lot more of these issues, and I think that that is very, very important for us.
And I do appreciate the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. McFadyen) attending the meetings in–dealing with the criminal justice system. We did get laws changed in Ottawa. And it wasn't just the politicians or the chief of police. Kelly, a victim, when he said to the ministers and all the caucuses, we'd rather have kids steal second base than steal a car, and then, we need these laws changed because there's no consequences, because these young people are taking their cars and I'm jogging and they're trying to kill me. I mean, that had a tremendous influence, and we should never underestimate the opportunities that we have as a united force to get some changes. Yes, we have to be accountable in our own province for the areas of hope and opportunity and choices that people make, and the–all this other parts of the criminal justice system. But we got laws changed. We got the attention of all parties. We–there's five changes to the Criminal Code, not all of them proclaimed yet, that are good. There's one that's stalled in the place that's supposed to be sober second thought. I'm not so sure that that definition applies in the case of last evening.
And I think–I first of all learned this with Meech Lake. I was involved with the Meech Lake discussions as the third party leader.
I would point out that I was elected in '88, in the middle of the leadership race; it wasn't exactly an opportune time. My briefing was very simple: Filmon's gonna win. You're at 6 percent in the polls. Our revenues are going up; you know, we're probably gonna be in a surplus situation. And you're basically dead in every seat you're running in. And other than that, it was–you know, we weren't peaking too early in 1988. And so, you gotta have a sense of humour when you get that kind of briefing. I actually found, the other day, my financial note, dare I say it, on that day.
* (15:50)
So it is–but I thought the '88-90 period, we did good work together. The Meech Lake task force report, chaired by Wally Fox-Decent, who I want to give credit for that job, I thought, did a great job at bringing all the parties together. We had a consensus report. And then we had a consensus report in the pre-Charlottetown period. These are tough issues. I mean, nobody wants to talk about the Constitution, and trying to get some consensus in Manitoba, I thought, was very useful as a way to go. It didn't–obviously, our report wasn't adopted in 1990, and certainly that represented an interesting debate in this House for those 10 days. And then, of course, we were quickly thereafter into the election campaign.
I want to, therefore, pay tribute to all of you in this Chamber and all the people that preceded you. I've enjoyed my time here. I love the debate; I do love it. I enjoy it; I'm going to miss it.
I am proud of the fact that all of us are working hard in our own teams to include more people. I'm very proud of the fact that we have in this Chamber the most number of women in any Chamber on a per capita basis in Canada. I think we should all be very proud of that and continue to work to have more equity in this Chamber but not in a way that's kind of in a token way.
I am proud of the fact that we have Aboriginal leaders in this Chamber. I am proud of the fact that we have new Canadians in this Chamber, visible minority people in this Chamber. I think this is very, very positive that the faces reflect all Manitobans, and that, for our case, means getting more farmers in our caucus, quite frankly, and that is a challenge. So we all bring a tremendous amount of assets to here from our backgrounds, from our experiences, from our communities, from our areas of expertise, and I just want to thank each and every one of you.
Finally, I want to thank my family for spending so much time without me, although I try to make most of the sports games that I can. I think that–I think you get the best advice–when I was there yesterday watching my daughter play volleyball–I think you get the best advice anywhere, any time, sitting with other parents in the stands. You cannot substitute standing at a hockey rink or going to ballet lessons or theatre lessons or any kind of activity with your kids, with other parents, with teachers and volunteers and–I want to thank all those people that have coached my kids, whether it's in dancing or in sports. It really makes a lot of difference. Ginny, of course, is a rock-solid, wonderful adviser. She's very smart politically, but a darling wife, and it's been great to have her support in this Legislature and, of course, beyond.
Finally, you know, sometimes we criticize each other too much. I remember when Harold Gilleshammer was appointed by the government to be on the immigration–an immigration judge. Well, he was a good person; he always was a good person. I think some of you that, you know, I think candidates would–some of you and some of us are going to go on to other careers. We should be a little more generous to our own profession. You know, you fight during election campaigns, but once somebody's moving on, good people should be supported no matter what their political stripe, and I've often believed that–you know, in Canada, it's interesting. You were talking about Canada and the United States.
Canada, we're a little bit more civilized during campaigns, although I wouldn't put on the television set in 2007 election or any other election campaign, but we're a little tougher on people after they leave office. Well, look at what's gone on, not just here, everywhere else. And I think, the United States, they are tough during campaigns, it's pretty personal, but they're a lot more dignified to the person who held the office after the campaign. I think that's something all of us should do.
You know, Manitoba's–you know the way we selected the L-G together. I warned the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. McFadyen) it's going to be tougher for you 'cause there's more Conservatives expecting the job than there is the New Democrats. None of our people were lining up. They didn't think there was a line. So–and it was–but it was–we tried to provide the Prime Minister of the day the most constructive group of people that he could look at and make a decision on, and I'm very proud of the decision he made, and I think all Manitobans are as well.
I would say that, since we are the leaders in that regard, perhaps we can be the leaders of post-career dignity for each other. Just because somebody runs for a political party and is elected as one doesn't mean they're bad. I mean, I hate to say this, but there's a lot of good people on the other side in this Legislature, and I believe that and I believe that strongly.
Finally, I want to thank the people of Manitoba. I did have a challenge–as I say, my first bit of advice was, we're under 10 percent in the polls. I have known the depth of–I guess it's like the ABC ad about the agony of defeat and the joy of victory. I certainly started off–but I always had the feeling that we were moving in the right direction, getting more support with each election campaign. But, certainly, the–people ask, what's the highlight, politically? Well, you know, it is the first time you get elected premier. It really is. I can't change that. I felt that, and it really was an honour. I really want to thank the people in 2003 and the 2007.
I want to thank everybody in this House. I want to thank our own caucus. You know, we go into our locker rooms, our caucuses. A lot of good debate goes on there. It's really important that you come out united, come out together. We've had some great debates in caucus, but we've always maintained our sense of humour and our sense of solidarity, and that's meant that we can move the agenda forward. So I want to thank all members, people of Manitoba, and the team I work with.
And all the staff that are here today, thank you very, very much for making me look good. They know–they just put the little notes in front of me and I just read them. We have–I want to thank all the people that made me look good. You hadn't had a lot to work with, but thank you very much.
And thank you to you, Mr. Speaker, and all your staff as well. It's been a real honour to serve in this place. Thank you.
[Applause]
Some Honourable Members: Ukrainian song sung. No translation available.
God grant you many years, many happy years. / God grant you many years, many happy years. / We wish you joy, / Joy, health and happiness. / God grant you many happy years.
[Applause]
Mr. Doer: I would take some Beatles songs, but–that was beautiful. Thank you very much.
* * *
Mr. Speaker: Is the House ready for the question?
Some Honourable Members: Question.
Mr. Speaker: The question–the question before the House is concurrence, third reading of Bill No. 4, The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act.
Is the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?
Some Honourable Members: No.
Some Honourable Members: Agreed.
Voice Vote
Mr. Speaker: All those in favour of the motion, say aye.
Some Honourable Members: Aye.
Mr. Speaker: All those opposed to the motion, say nay.
Some Honourable Members: Nay.
Mr. Speaker: In my opinion, the Ayes have it.
Mr. Goertzen: On division.
Mr. Speaker: On division.
* (16:00)
The Acting Deputy Sergeant-at-Arms (Mr. Ray Gislason): His Honour the Lieutenant-Governor.
His Honour Philip S. Lee, Lieutenant-Governor of the Province of Manitoba, having entered the House and being seated on the throne, Mr. Speaker addressed His Honour the Lieutenant-Governor in the following words:
Mr. Speaker: Your Honour:
At this sitting, the Legislative Assembly has passed certain bills that I ask Your Honour to give assent to.
Madam Clerk Assistant (Monique Grenier):
Bill 4–The Community Revitalization Tax Increment Financing Act; Loi sur le financement fiscal de la revitalisation urbaine
Bill 8–The Civil Service Superannuation Amendment Act (Enhanced Manitoba Hydro Employee Benefits and Other Amendments); Loi modifiant la Loi sur la pension de la fonction publique (prestations améliorées à l'intention des employés d'Hydro-Manitoba et autres modifications)
Bill 9–The Social Work Profession Act; Loi sur la profession de travailleur social
Bill 16–The Police Services Act; Loi sur les services de police
Bill 26–The Apprenticeship and Certification Act; Loi sur l'apprentissage et la reconnaissance professionnelle
Bill 31–The Manitoba Floodway Authority Amendment Act; Loi modifiant la Loi sur la Commission du canal de dérivation du Manitoba
Bill 35–The Municipal Conflict of Interest and Campaign Financing Act (Various Acts Amended); Loi sur les conflits d'intérêts au sein des municipalités et le financement des campagnes électorales municipales (modification de diverses dispositions législatives)
Bill 36–The Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation Amendment Act (Enhanced Compensation for Catastrophic Injuries); Loi modifiant la Loi sur la Société d'assurance publique du Manitoba (majoration de l'indemnisation en cas de lésions catastrophiques)
Bill 37–The Public Schools Amendment Act (Limited At Large Elections of Trustees); Loi modifiant la Loi sur les écoles publiques (modalités d'élection des commissaires dans des circonstances limitées)
Bill 217–The Hunting, Fishing and Trapping Heritage Act; Loi sur la chasse, la pêche sportive et le piégeage patrimoniaux
Bill 226–The Pregnancy and Infant Loss Awareness Day Act; Loi sur la Journée de sensibilisation au deuil périnatal
Bill 238–The Service Animals Protection Act; Loi sur la protection des animaux d'assistance
Madam Clerk (Patricia Chaychuk): In Her Majesty's name, His Honour assents to these bills.
His Honour was then pleased to retire.
* * *
"God Save the Queen" was sung.
"O Canada" was sung.
Mr. Speaker: Please be seated.
Hon. Dave Chomiak (Government House Leader): It's my honour to be standing here to ask leave of the House to adjourn at 5 o'clock. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker: Is it the will of the House to call it 5 o'clock? [Agreed]
Okay. The hour now being 5 p.m., this House is adjourned and stands adjourned, and will return at the call of the Speaker.